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Jun 12 2020 08:11am
If you want to play around and plan a assassin build like this i can sum it up easier how you can calculate it:

Links:
For attack speed:
Google "diablo attack speed calculator" https://d2.lc/IAS/
Google "claw basics d2jsp" https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=56743882
For skills:
Google "diablo 2 skill calculator" http://www.diablo1.ru/poleznoe/calculator.php

Kick basics: https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads/kicking-basics.127905/
For chance to hit, ar, defense etc check this out: https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=31372964
Breakpoints: https://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Breakpoints
Arreat summit for wsm speed weps, items, chars etc.


Okay, lets start:

IAS:
First off we want to know that we reach desired breakpoints. We can use ias calculator, but that is not as correct due to we are not using full kickseries like displayed there.

So we wsm bug if possible:
Quote
RC = Base speed right claw (above the boots)
LC = Base speed left claw (above the gloves)
---
(( [RC] + [LC] ) / 2 ) + ( [RC] - [LC] )


Example's:
Runic/GT + Suawaya: ((-30 + 0) / 2) + (-30 - 0) = -45 wsm
Feral + Suawaya: ((-20 + 0) / 2) + (-20 - 0) = -30 wsm

Quote
9 FPA trap laying speed:
AWSM | IAS %
------------------
-10 | 89
-15 | 75
-20 | 63
-25 | 52
-30 | 42
-35 | 34
-40 | 26
-45 | 19
-50 | 13


Quote
Kick ias:
IAS counts from any source except off-hand weapon.
WSM is averaged between claws when dual wielding.
Skill_IAS is any bonus derived from sources such as burst of speed and fanatacism.
Note that lower WSM number are faster.

EIAS = ((120*ias)/(120+ias)) + skill_ias - WSM
Forexample: ((120*60)/(120+60)) + 0 - (-45) = 85

Note that due to technical reasons what is commonly described as the "initial kick" is actually the last kick in the series; follow-up kicks are actually applied first.

Breakpoints for initial kick speed:
EIAS Frames
0 12
9 11
19 10
31 9
45 8
63 7

Breakpoints for follow-up kicks:
EIAS Frames
0 4
25 3
67 2 (this frame cannot be reached)

Does not really matter, we reach max kickspeed.

Its important to know that diablo operates in frames and that each second is 25 frames.
So if we have 2 frames we do like this: 25 / 2 = 12,5 attacks pr seconds.

So our attack pr second is:
25/3 = 8,3333 (follow up kicks)
25/7 = 3,57 (last kick)

1 / 9,3333 = 0,12 seconds to excecute each follow up kick
1 / 3,57 = 0,28 seconds to excecute each follow up kick
0,28 + 0,12 + 0,12 =0,52 seconds to excecute 1 kick serie(3kicks)
2 kickseries = 0,52*2 = 1,04 seconds.

I dno a formula to directly convert that into attacks pr seconds whole second. But 2 * kickseries of 3 = 1,04 seconds.

As you can see it can be up to each player if he wants 3 kickseries or longer. Its also worth to mention that last kick has kb, which can put enemy out of range, but KB is also a stun effect! So kicking to long before KB usually means less stun and less safety.


Quote
2 frames wirl ias:
We want our 4 fpa ww hitchecks which will be achieved at a MWSM of [-13]. It is simply calculated for each claw seperately by this formula: (WSM - [claw's IAS amount])
Since runic talons [-30] and feral claws [-20] already fulfill the [-13] MWSM condition, they don't need any additional ias. A suwayyah [0] would need at least 15 ias and a war fist [10] 25 ias.

Our slowest claw is 0.
0-35 = -35



Kick damage formula:
Quote
Formulas for Dragon Talon:
number of kicks: 1 + (Slvl / 6)
+ attack rating %: (35 * Slvl) - 15
+ Damage %: 7 * Slvl - 2


Quote
MinDamage= (str + dex - 20) / 4 * (100 + skill_bonus) / 100 + BootMinDam * (100 + (str * StrBonus / 100) + skill_bonus + non_weapon ED + Aura_bonus) / 100
MaxDamage=(str + dex - 20) / 3 * (100 + skill_bonus) / 100 + BootMaxDam * (100 + (str * StrBonus / 100) + skill_bonus + non_weapon ED + Aura+bonus) / 100

Myrmidon Greaves(156 str requirement on upped gores):
Min dmg - 83
Max dmg - 149
Str bonus - 120


Quote
You should always average out everything.
To average out anything the formula is:
(Max-Min)/2+Min

Deadly strike does not work with kick...
AR from claw is hidden but works.
Elemental dmg from claw and venom is hidden but works.
Does not benefit from damage in claw, but does benefit from offhand/gear enhanced dmg, but not +direct damage sorces


Venom dmg:
Formula for skill:
Stat Level
1-8 9-16 17-22 23-28 >28
Minimum Poison Bit Rate 1152 + (384*slvl) 128 + (512*slvl) (640*slvl) - 1920 (768*slvl) - 4736 (896*slvl) - 8320
Maximum Poison Bit Rate 1664 + (384*slvl) 640 + (512*slvl) (640*slvl) - 1408 (768*slvl) - 4224 (896*slvl) - 7808

Duration: 116 + (6 * Slvl)
Lasts for 0,4 seconds in normal - 0,6 seconds in nightmare - 0,8 seconds in hell

Formula for real venom dmg:
(Venom dmg * (% psn when cast) * (% psn when duelling) ) * 0,8

On fast attacks like kick and wirl and with decent hit chance u should only look upon venom as (damage pr second) + (1 duration 0,8 as aftereffect)

Enchant lvl 23 (demon limb, u can facet it ofc):
Bonus to AR% = 218
Min fire dmg = 112
Max fire dmg = 142
Average fire dmg = (142-112)/2+112 = 127


Wirl dmg:
Formula:
+% Attack rating: (5 * Slvl) - 5
+% Damage: (8 * Slvl) - 58

Claw masteries:
+% Attack Rating: 20 + (10 * Slvl)
+% Damage: 31 + (4 * Slvl)
% Crit: min( [25 * [ (110*slvl) / (slvl+6) ] / 100] , 25) (which basicly mean: 25*(110*slvl) / (slvl+6) / 100 and then round down..)

Physical dmg wirl/DC etc:
Wepon Min dmg: MinWepDmg * (1+((on-wep ed)/100)) + WepMin (Multiply MinWepDmg with 1,5 if eth)
Wepon Max dmg: MaxWepDmg * (1+((on-wep ed)/100)) + WepMax (Multiplay MaxWepDmg with 1,5 if eth)
Average WepDmg: (Max-Min)/2+Min
Average offhand dmg: (AllMaxSources - AllMinSources)/2+AllMinSources[/CODE]
Total psy dmg each wep:
(Wep Average dmg + Offhand average dmg) * (1+((off wepon ED% + Stat bonus + Skillbonus + Aurabonus)/100)) * Chance to Double factor


Chance to deal double damage when dealing with Critic and Deadly strike:
chance% = %CS + ((1-%CS)/100)*%DS)
Note that we usually calculate average dmg. So an easy way to implement this as average is to do like this:
Physical dmg * (1+(chance to double%/100))

Open wounds formula:
OW = (45*clvl-1319)*0,25*DR%

Crushing blow formula:
Remaining life / 10 * (1-(%DR/100)) - Direct DR

Attack rating:
Base:
Base AR = (Dexterity * 5) - 35 + ClassBonus
Class ClassBonus

Amazon +5
Assassin +15
Barbarian +20
Necromancer -10
Paladin +20
Sorceress -15
Druid +5

Final:
Attack Rating = [(Base AR + Direct AR) * (1 + %AR/100)]

Chance to hit:
Be aware that wirlwind is bugged. If 1 wepon miss, then it uses that ar for next claw attack as well.
Chance to Hit = 2 * atlvl / (atlvl + dflvl) * AR / (AR + Defense) ; multiply by 100 to get CtH in %

Chance to hit vs block
CtB: 100-(%block)

Combined final chance to hit (note that an attack that dont penetrate defense dont trigger "FBR" and do not stun at all) :
Combined: CtH% * (100 - Block%) / 100

Full direct output dmg vs enemies:
PVP PENALTY IS: 0,17 (Not inlcuded in CB or OW formulas, those are already nerfed for pvp)
Elemental dmg: Average ele dmg * 0,17 * ((100-enemy res)/100)
Venom dmg: (Average venom dmg * %when cast * %when dueling) / 0,8 * 0,17 * ((100-enemyResist)/100)
Physical dmg: (TotalPsyDmg * 0,17 * (1-(DR%/100)
Magical dmg: Average dmg * 0,17

(did not included direct absorb and stuff like magic absorb on spirit, direct dr, and mdr eq, as there are complex bugs here)

Real dps:
((Elemental output + Magic dmg output + Physical dmg output) * (25/Frames of attack)) + Venom real DPS
Be aware that crushing blow is added before any other damage sources. To calculate this in you need to more or less put up attack for attack like i did on first post. If u have 50% chance u can simulate half of the CB affects to miss etc xD

After effects:
Venom output from last hit. (0,8 seconds worth of dmg)
OW (% chance to be active or not, last for 8 seconds)
Amplify dmg to boost any other physical attack, and to break mindblast immune builds etc.

This post was edited by gel87 on Jun 12 2020 08:17am
Member
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Jun 13 2020 02:07am
Quote (patalo @ Jun 12 2020 09:03am)
^lastsupper maybe this can interest you / add some

E me read later ;)


Thanks 🤗

Nice Guide gel :thumbsup:
Member
Posts: 21,418
Joined: Sep 3 2006
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Jun 13 2020 05:16am
Quote (LastSupper @ Jun 13 2020 10:07am)
Thanks 🤗

Nice Guide gel :thumbsup:


Thanks mate :D

I never get it 100% right in the first post, but all should be good now xD
I field tested this on a tripsin on asgard before ever calculating anything and it worked way better than i would imagine lol^^
I did try BER UM claw etc as well, nothing could compare to BerBer claw^^ On eu i made pure kicksin, still searching for a chaos lol^^ It's only lvl 89 though xD
Member
Posts: 32,338
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Jun 13 2020 10:41am
Quote (gel87 @ 13 Jun 2020 13:16)
On eu i made pure kicksin, still searching for a chaos lol^^ It's only lvl 89 though xD


Level 89?? C'mon don't be lazy! You can easily level her as a deadly trapsin and then respect her. (The respect thing is still a new a marvelous discover for me, so much chars erased in the past for fucking one single point :rofl: )

Member
Posts: 21,418
Joined: Sep 3 2006
Gold: 1,110.00
Jun 13 2020 11:08am
Quote (cantero @ Jun 13 2020 06:41pm)
Level 89?? C'mon don't be lazy! You can easily level her as a deadly trapsin and then respect her. (The respect thing is still a new a marvelous discover for me, so much chars erased in the past for fucking one single point :rofl: )


ye, still have the stormlash setup on mule so could teoretical even do p8 diablo, but it would require me to mule away the unperms ^^

the name is epic as well, laddybich or smt like that xD
Member
Posts: 62,194
Joined: Aug 3 2013
Gold: 530.40
Jun 19 2020 11:31pm
Assuming I do this on GA (the priv server), what you think about this build:
2sin
40ias
Fools
Chance to cast Amp
5 life rep
2 socket
3 LS
3 MB
3WB
Greater talons
(Main hand)
Ber Ber

2sin
3LS
3MB
3 blade shield
2 sockets
5 rep
30 lite res (3rd prefix unless I’m missing something)
Eth indesrirvule (eth to lower Dex req)
2x jewels like 7fhr/4rep/10 all res/maybe - req as 4th modifier? Or mana
War fist (slowest base for WSM)

For 102fcr
Griffs (since no 08 on realm) Cham
2x 10fcr/120ar/str/Dex or life or life rep/mana/all res or single
Arach
Trang
Gores (maybe dancers vs. some)
2/17+FCR Ammy with Dex/life/rep/resist
Scarab enigma
9x 45 shadow (prefer this over 9x trap I think)
10x 20/5 Or other SCs

1-5 into kick for 3 kick
Max LS all synergies
1 venom and rest Mind Blast or max venom and 1 MB
All shadow disc skills


65fcr build
2sin/20fcr/vis/2os (extra mods) Ber Ber or 2x 30ed/10all Res/4rep/7fhr jewel
Trang
Arach
Raven
10fcr ring
Maras or better rare Ammy

Or same as above but guillames and 20fcr Ammy


Member
Posts: 21,418
Joined: Sep 3 2006
Gold: 1,110.00
Jun 20 2020 04:49am
Quote (Fagzuu @ Jun 20 2020 07:31am)
Assuming I do this on GA (the priv server), what you think about this build:
2sin
40ias
Fools
Chance to cast Amp
5 life rep
2 socket
3 LS
3 MB
3WB
Greater talons
(Main hand)
Ber Ber

2sin
3LS
3MB
3 blade shield
2 sockets
5 rep
30 lite res (3rd prefix unless I’m missing something)
Eth indesrirvule (eth to lower Dex req)
2x jewels like 7fhr/4rep/10 all res/maybe - req as 4th modifier? Or mana
War fist (slowest base for WSM)

For 102fcr
Griffs (since no 08 on realm) Cham
2x 10fcr/120ar/str/Dex or life or life rep/mana/all res or single
Arach
Trang
Gores (maybe dancers vs. some)
2/17+FCR Ammy with Dex/life/rep/resist
Scarab enigma
9x 45 shadow (prefer this over 9x trap I think)
10x 20/5 Or other SCs

1-5 into kick for 3 kick
Max LS all synergies
1 venom and rest Mind Blast or max venom and 1 MB
All shadow disc skills


65fcr build
2sin/20fcr/vis/2os (extra mods) Ber Ber or 2x 30ed/10all Res/4rep/7fhr jewel
Trang
Arach
Raven
10fcr ring
Maras or better rare Ammy

Or same as above but guillames and 20fcr Ammy


i had very simular on asgard, works awsome.
4th mod in offhand claw should be 9str for dmg or 9dex for ar or 8life.

i used 8 x traps and had cube with 2 x 6venom/6fade/10psn claw + mara + 2 sojs + demon limb(kept bo shield in stash and dropped cta on floor for ench (u can ofc floordrop shield as well xD)

i had the advantage of both bug belt anf wiz gloves, so i used 9 x 36ar/20life scs. but check ur res and fill gap with 20/5@.

when it comes between trap sks and shadows sks i think trap or mix is better for such build. cube cast fade level is:
claws(12), sojs(2), mara(2), arach(1), eni(2), griffon(1), torch(3), annie (1) = 24. with eni thats 32% dr without even skilling fade.

when it comes to offhand claw i would not bother with bladeshield, i had it hardskilled on mine, but might not be worth it. so for offhand claw i would use 2sin/3ls/3mb/3wb skills.

the only problem without walk is frw, ias, and fhr.

fhr:
ur currently at 14%.
i would not use shadows boots on such build, so i guess u need to fill gap with 2 x sks at the cost of 90 base life.

when it comes to wsm bug claws wf gives best in vombi with gt as u planned.

(-30 + 10)/2+(-30 - 10) = - 50

im almost done with a complete excel sheet, then i can help you better with shadow sks vs traps.

mine had 10,5k ls dmg. u probarly reach around same or a little higher. so u can save skills into fade/mb/clawblock via shadows, just keep in mind that hardpoint into mb makes sm cast it more. so in reallity u save 2 hardpoints by using shadows at the cost of +1 traps.

there is no need for 65fcr gear, but if u do i would go:
Guilaume cham
wisp/raven/dwarf
rest same.

This post was edited by gel87 on Jun 20 2020 04:52am
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Jun 20 2020 04:51am
1 pt smite > all kicks and mele attacks and whatever so what to even care about?
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Jun 20 2020 04:55am
Quote (Wisteria @ Jun 20 2020 12:51pm)
1 pt smite > all kicks and mele attacks and whatever so what to even care about?


funny that i won vs 3 smiters last time i played with lvl 89 kicker and chaos offhand. like 3 or 4 days ago, but yes smiters > all melee, thats why u might wanna add 7-10k traps.

smiter > all closeup attacks in d2. thats the same for all.
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Posts: 62,194
Joined: Aug 3 2013
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Jun 20 2020 10:54am
Quote (gel87 @ Jun 20 2020 06:49am)
i had very simular on asgard, works awsome.
4th mod in offhand claw should be 9str for dmg or 9dex for ar or 8life.

i used 8 x traps and had cube with 2 x 6venom/6fade/10psn claw + mara + 2 sojs + demon limb(kept bo shield in stash and dropped cta on floor for ench (u can ofc floordrop shield as well xD)

i had the advantage of both bug belt anf wiz gloves, so i used 9 x 36ar/20life scs. but check ur res and fill gap with 20/5@.

when it comes between trap sks and shadows sks i think trap or mix is better for such build. cube cast fade level is:
claws(12), sojs(2), mara(2), arach(1), eni(2), griffon(1), torch(3), annie (1) = 24. with eni thats 32% dr without even skilling fade.

when it comes to offhand claw i would not bother with bladeshield, i had it hardskilled on mine, but might not be worth it. so for offhand claw i would use 2sin/3ls/3mb/3wb skills.

the only problem without walk is frw, ias, and fhr.

fhr:
ur currently at 14%.
i would not use shadows boots on such build, so i guess u need to fill gap with 2 x sks at the cost of 90 base life.

when it comes to wsm bug claws wf gives best in vombi with gt as u planned.

(-30 + 10)/2+(-30 - 10) = - 50

im almost done with a complete excel sheet, then i can help you better with shadow sks vs traps.

mine had 10,5k ls dmg. u probarly reach around same or a little higher. so u can save skills into fade/mb/clawblock via shadows, just keep in mind that hardpoint into mb makes sm cast it more. so in reallity u save 2 hardpoints by using shadows at the cost of +1 traps.

there is no need for 65fcr gear, but if u do i would go:
Guilaume cham
wisp/raven/dwarf
rest same.



You really care about the added trap damage that much instead of all the functionality of 9x shadow?

Just from my head, my trap damagw would be 1-9450, with no trap GCs, which is a little over 800 more max damage than the common WW hybrid sins which get exactly 8610.

Regarding fhr, I would likely use 3x 5fhr SCs to hit the 28fhr BP instead of 2x 12fhr GCs, thus only be a 60 life lose.

But given the skill situation, I can see your point about doing a mix, depending on where all the skills fall such as weapon block, fade and MB.

Being from East, we typically don’t do cube buff, but on GA, seems people generally don’t care since there is a mix of rules from all realms.

But I’ll build it up when I get time and post the full stats in here and we can debate and tweak.

I’m always down to experiment with sins :)

This post was edited by Fagzuu on Jun 20 2020 10:55am
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