Quote (ofthevoid @ May 18 2019 07:36pm)

Murder by abortion is not illegal. They are comparable in the sense that increased costs will decrease rates.

I'm not looking to win the war, that's a tall task and that ship has sailed but if we win this battle and abortion rates go down this is a win I will be happy about. I'm being pragmatic.

Quote (Handcuffs @ May 18 2019 08:40pm)

So you want to call it murder, but neither treat nor punish it as such?

Quote (ofthevoid @ May 18 2019 07:43pm)

It's murder in my eyes and in many others. That doesn't mean the law agrees or that I can magically change the law. Like I said it's about being pragmatic to hopefully get a positive. If I were to take the absolutist perspective, this battle fails, instead I rather be pragmatic and get the win, which as I said before means lower rates of abortions.

Quote (ofthevoid @ May 18 2019 08:43pm)

It's murder in my eyes and in many others. That doesn't mean the law agrees or that I can magically change the law. Like I said it's about being pragmatic to hopefully get a positive. If I were to take the absolutist perspective, this battle fails, instead I rather be pragmatic and get the win, which as I said before means lower rates of abortions.

Quote (Handcuffs @ May 18 2019 08:46pm)

Murder has a very real legal definition though, and reluctance to treat and punish it as "murder" comes across as utilizing hyperbolic language in the same way you criticize pro-choice advocates.

Quote (ofthevoid @ May 18 2019 08:52pm)

You're being obtuse. Just because I can't fit the whole apple in my mouth doesn't mean I can't take a bite out. I keep reiterating that pragmatism here will get things done and you're talking about legal definitions. We (the pro life side) will be in net positive if we can get lower rates of abortions.

Quote (ofthevoid @ May 18 2019 07:52pm)

You're being obtuse. Just because I can't fit the whole apple in my mouth doesn't mean I can't take a bite out. I keep reiterating that pragmatism here will get things done and you're talking about legal definitions. We (the pro life side) will be in net positive if we can get lower rates of abortions.

Quote (Handcuffs @ May 18 2019 08:55pm)

I'm trying to understand your position more. How is it "obtuse" to question why you want to call abortion murder but neither treat it nor punish it as such?

It's similar to vegans who call meat production murder, and then people rightfully call out the inconsistencies of that use of the word and how hyperbolic it is. As a vegan, I agree that calling it "murder" is hyperbolic.

Quote (Thor123422 @ May 18 2019 11:24pm)

Thinking your partner is comparing you dis-favorably to previous partners is something that just oozes insecurity.

Assuming your partner views all past relationships with rose-colored glasses is also something that likely stems from insecurity.

I understand that most people are driven by their insecurities without ever realizing it. Introspection is hard and unpleasant, so most people don't make it a habit, and even the ones that do don't necessarily take steps in a healthier direction.

Quote (Beowulf @ May 18 2019 08:54pm)

Nobody takes issue with the reasonable side of your view

the problem is you're covering your cake in shit frosting by your murder rhetoric that actually has shown you to be more hyperbolic than plague was when this all started

Quote (Handcuffs @ May 18 2019 08:55pm)

I'm trying to understand your position more. How is it "obtuse" to question why you want to call abortion murder but neither treat it nor punish it as such?

It's similar to vegans who call meat production murder, and then people rightfully call out the inconsistencies of that use of the word and how hyperbolic it is. As a vegan, I agree that calling it "murder" is hyperbolic.