Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 29 2020 10:35am)

Yeah, and those with middle income are strangled by their repayment rates.



That's the key idea: if we base the repayment rates on the income a degree allows the average graduate from a field to achieve, then this will automatically take the air out of inflated degree prices. Banks wouldnt be willing give out loans of X dollars for degrees where they have to, on average, expect to only recuperate <X. This, in turn, would mean that colleges have to lower the price tag for low value degrees.



People who have the financial breathing room paying more, so that those who have little to no breathing room can pay less, is generally a good thing. That's the kind of solidarity the political left is always talking about. We just have to find a sensible definition of "breathing room", so that people doing fine but not great arent soaked.



Your idea is a system where people can get high value degrees for cheap. Which is a fine concept, but ultimately only feasible if most of higher education is government-run instead of private. You basically want the university system from continental Europe. Which isnt even a point of view I can disagree with; I personally benefitted a lot from this system after all. ;)

I just think that going from America's current system to the continental European system would be too big a jump. Imho, the U.S. system can be improved, can be made more equitable and see its financial pressure defused, without requiring such a huge (and frankly unrealistic) paradigm shift.

Quote (Thor123422 @ 29 Nov 2020 18:07)

Thing is your whole system is just progressive taxation with extra steps.

If you dont cap cost those lower payments just result in never paying it off.

Quote (Bazi @ 29 Nov 2020 17:59)

Someone with a biology major will still end up in ridiculous amounts of debt even if they have a maximum amount they are having to pay with your proposal

Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 29 2020 12:40pm)

THAT'S THE POINT!!! :)

With capped repayment rates, the banks would eat the losses from those individuals which end up unemployed or low income. If the share of graduates from a field or a university who end up underperforming this way becomes too high, it becomes unprofitable for the bank to provide loans for this degree/college altogether. Which leads to a collapse in enrollment, which leads to the college lowering the tuition for the program (or scrapping it altogether).

Conversely, the higher the tuition and thus the loans for a particular degree are, the higher the implied break-even-average-graduate-salary.



If the repayment rate is tied to income and capped at a very workable level, the absolute amount of debt is largely irrelevant for the individual, he's guaranteed not to be crushed or drawn into bankruptcy by it. The debt becomes his bank's problem.

Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 29 2020 11:40am)

THAT'S THE POINT!!! :)

With capped repayment rates, the banks would eat the losses from those individuals which end up unemployed or low income. If the share of graduates from a field or a university who end up underperforming this way becomes too high, it becomes unprofitable for the bank to provide loans for this degree/college altogether. Which leads to a collapse in enrollment, which leads to the college lowering the tuition for the program (or scrapping it altogether).

Conversely, the higher the tuition and thus the loans for a particular degree are, the higher the implied break-even-average-graduate-salary.



If the repayment rate is tied to income and capped at a very workable level, the absolute amount of debt is largely irrelevant for the individual, he's guaranteed not to be crushed or drawn into bankruptcy by it. The debt becomes his bank's problem.

Quote (fender @ Nov 29 2020 03:55pm)

similar stupid arguments were made against the abolition of slavery and women's right to vote, lol. "can't do that - not because we don't want it but... errrr... well... b-b-because it would totally lead to division amongst the poor"...

funny how those narratives never seem to die, no matter how often they are debunked. resilient as the 'trickle down' myth, which is strangely never called a one-sided transfer of wealth towards one particular group. funny how that only ever comes up when something would benefit the lower classes...

Quote (Thor123422 @ Nov 29 2020 04:06pm)

Something something something if we don't let billionaires fuck us raw they will leave something something something job creators something something something trickle down

Quote (ofthevoid @ Nov 29 2020 06:56am)

As far as forgiveness? Maybe after like 20 years which would also depend on how much they make and what % of income that payment is.

Quote (Bazi @ 29 Nov 2020 18:55)

This is fair the but there is a huge mental burden involved with being this financially behind. Also affects other things in your life like credit score and acquiring loans. Even if the loan isn’t paid off it will still affect those populations for a long time, possibly life long if the loan is never intended To be paid off

Quote (excellence @ Nov 29 2020 12:15pm)

long as the govt refunds people who paid for college ‘in cash’ (ie: working during school, saving up and working in summers/winters, going to cheaper schools for some or all of their undergrad, military service, grants/scholarships, family assistance etc.) then there is no problem with forgiving student debt