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Nov 29 2020 07:45am
This has been trending on twitter lately, that it cost more to give billionaires their tax cuts than it would have to write off student loan debt. Aside from despising poor people getting stuff for free (which i do) is there a reason the tax cuts would've been better than to reduce the financial burden on a large demographic of society carrying student loans?


https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2019/jun/30/student-debt-loan-forgiveness-bernie-sanders

This post was edited by duffman316 on Nov 29 2020 08:02am
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Nov 29 2020 08:31am
The tax cuts for billionaires were a (predictable) mistake. Doesnt mean that full student loan forgiveness would be good policy. In particular, it would further fuel the political divisions along educational lines. College- and non-college-educated America are increasingly apart in their worldview, their values, their outlook on life, their policy preferences and their economic situation. A massive transfer of wealth from the general public (all taxpayers) toward one group is divisive policy in general, and even more so when the beneficiaries tend to be (and come from) a more privileged class. Furthermore, it would be divisive because those who had just finished paying off their student loan debt in recent years would be fucked over too.


On the fly, I cant come up with a good proposal that would solve the issue in a fair manner, but a full government bailout of student loan debt is not the solution.
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Nov 29 2020 08:34am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 29 2020 06:31am)
The tax cuts for billionaires were a (predictable) mistake. Doesnt mean that full student loan forgiveness would be good policy. In particular, it would further fuel the political divisions along educational lines. College- and non-college-educated America are increasingly apart in their worldview, their values, their outlook on life, their policy preferences and their economic situation. A massive transfer of wealth from the general public (all taxpayers) toward one group is divisive policy in general, and even more so when the beneficiaries tend to be (and come from) a more privileged class. Furthermore, it would be divisive because those who had just finished paying off their student loan debt in recent years would be fucked over too.


On the fly, I cant come up with a good proposal that would solve the issue in a fair manner, but a full government bailout of student loan debt is not the solution.


I think some sort of normal debt program.. % rates that people can deal with. Bankruptcy if needed, and proven to be needed by individuals.
smaller overall debt if low income is proven.
fuck the IRS does it.. these people should be able to do the same.
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Nov 29 2020 08:55am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ 29 Nov 2020 15:31)
The tax cuts for billionaires were a (predictable) mistake. Doesnt mean that full student loan forgiveness would be good policy. In particular, it would further fuel the political divisions along educational lines. College- and non-college-educated America are increasingly apart in their worldview, their values, their outlook on life, their policy preferences and their economic situation. A massive transfer of wealth from the general public (all taxpayers) toward one group is divisive policy in general, and even more so when the beneficiaries tend to be (and come from) a more privileged class. Furthermore, it would be divisive because those who had just finished paying off their student loan debt in recent years would be fucked over too.


On the fly, I cant come up with a good proposal that would solve the issue in a fair manner, but a full government bailout of student loan debt is not the solution.


similar stupid arguments were made against the abolition of slavery and women's right to vote, lol. "can't do that - not because we don't want it but... errrr... well... b-b-because it would totally lead to division amongst the poor"...

funny how those narratives never seem to die, no matter how often they are debunked. resilient as the 'trickle down' myth, which is strangely never called a one-sided transfer of wealth towards one particular group. funny how that only ever comes up when something would benefit the lower classes...
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Nov 29 2020 08:56am
Cap the interest rate on student loans to something like the current yield on a 10 year bond.

As far as forgiveness? Maybe after like 20 years which would also depend on how much they make and what % of income that payment is.

I don’t think forgiveness is a good idea though and I say that as someone that paid out of pocket for a bachelors and now a masters.

Part of being an adult is making sacrifices. If you want to have a nice job with a decent salary it’s on you to pick up the tab not have Joe Shmoe working at Dollar General making 12 dollars an hour pay for it in taxes.
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Nov 29 2020 09:06am
Something something something if we don't let billionaires fuck us raw they will leave something something something job creators something something something trickle down
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Nov 29 2020 09:12am
Quote (ofthevoid @ 29 Nov 2020 15:56)
Cap the interest rate on student loans to something like the current yield on a 10 year bond.

As far as forgiveness? Maybe after like 20 years which would also depend on how much they make and what % of income that payment is.

I don’t think forgiveness is a good idea though and I say that as someone that paid out of pocket for a bachelors and now a masters.

Part of being an adult is making sacrifices. If you want to have a nice job with a decent salary it’s on you to pick up the tab not have Joe Shmoe working at Dollar General making 12 dollars an hour pay for it in taxes.


true. joe shmoe from dollar general already has enough on his plate paying for subsididies and bailouts to big oil and wall street...

so here's an idea: how about we leave joe shmoe's income alone, and instead let donald trump, betsy devos, and jeff bezos pay for student loan forgiveness? would you be ok with that?
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Nov 29 2020 09:13am
Quote (fender @ 29 Nov 2020 15:55)
similar stupid arguments were made against the abolition of slavery and women's right to vote, lol. "can't do that - not because we don't want it but... errrr... well... b-b-because it would totally lead to division amongst the poor"...

funny how those narratives never seem to die, no matter how often they are debunked. resilient as the 'trickle down' myth, which is strangely never called a one-sided transfer of wealth towards one particular group. funny how that only ever comes up when something would benefit the lower classes...


Burger flippers and Amazon box slaves paying taxes to bail out college kids (who look down on them and proceed to vote for all the policies which make life harder for blue collar people like them) would of course be divisive policy, lol. One must be severely detached from reality to think otherwise.

This point is entirely unrelated to trickle down economics being a fraud. There is no logical incoherence in my position, which is that both wall street tax cuts and (blanket) student loan forgiveness are bad policy. But keep trying to stack even more tired buzzwords like "debunked" on top of each other, perhaps you'll some day convince someone with it.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Nov 29 2020 09:13am
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Nov 29 2020 09:16am
Quote (fender @ 29 Nov 2020 16:12)
true. joe shmoe from dollar general already has enough on his plate paying for subsididies and bailouts to big oil and wall street...

so here's an idea: how about we leave joe shmoe's income alone, and instead let donald trump, betsy devos, and jeff bezos pay for student loan forgiveness? would you be ok with that?


How about we let the billionaire class pay a larger share, and use the money raised this way for policy which benefits everyone instead of policy which exclusively helps an already privileged segment of society?
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Nov 29 2020 09:24am
The best argument is that a tax cut for the rich isn't giving people anything or costing us anything. Its simply taking less from someone and the government overspending.

Forgiving student debt is a literal wealth transfer from anyone who pays taxes to people in debt with student loans.

The best solution is to refinance with low interest rates, remove loan guarantees and let the market handle the rest. Those stuck paying those loans are a good reminder of what happens when government policy gives banks and universities free reign to suck trillions out of people with no way out.

Join the military if you want free college or do well in school and get some grants/scholarships.
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