Quote (fender @ Nov 12 2019 04:12am)

Quote (cambovenzi @ 12 Nov 2019 09:21)

Yes diplomacy and investigating corruption is just like armed bank robbery to you. what a great comparison.

Quote (fender @ 11 Nov 2019 10:07)

- first of all, it explicitly states on the first page that it's NOT a verbatim transcript. the actual transcript and recording of that 'perfect call' are hidden away on a server for top secret material. so if the trump team is so sure there's nothing bad about his call they should release them.

- secondly, you don't have to use the words 'i want you to do x, otherwise you won't get y' in order for a 'court-thight' quid pro quo to be established. the timing of the call and trump's team freezing the funds, as well as the obvious and not very subtle implications that even the polished 'transcript' documents, don't allow for any reasonable doubt - if you're not actively trying not to see it.

- EU ambassador sondland, a loyal trump toady, who donated a million dollars of his own money to trump's campaign and acted for weeks like he couldn't recall the administration putting any pressure on ukraine amended his testimony, acknowledging a quid pro quo.

- mick mulvaney admitted it was a quid pro quo on national tv.

- trump asked ukraine and china to investigate the bidens on national tv (yet another federal election law violation btw).

- there already was a history of trump withholding aid to pressure ukraine into doing personal favours for him: in 2018 he delayed the delivery of javelin anti-tank missiles to force then president poroshenko to stop cooperating with the mueller investigation into manafort's ukraine dealings (so much for donnie bonespur being really concerned with corruption in ukraine).

Quote (kalelvszod @ Nov 12 2019 03:36am)

Even if trump is guilty of quid pro quo isnt biden and his son also guilty of crimes ? Im sorry running for office shouldnt give you immunity should be opposite actually. Everyone crying impeach trump while hilary is walking around laughing her ass off at how stupid the public eye is.democrats and others in office have done far worse than trump.this whole thing stinks mainly because its happened behind close doors and with the media spitting bs all the time its hard to even know what to believe these days. If jeffrey epstein can get whacked that easily and nobody is accountable for that why should we even give a fuck about this. Isnt that the bigger story tbh anyways ?

Quote (Thor123422 @ Nov 12 2019 04:38am)

Everybody pay attention, this post is the very definition of 'whataboutism".

Quote (kalelvszod @ Nov 12 2019 03:39am)

Elaborate please

Quote (Thor123422 @ Nov 12 2019 04:54am)

Your post can be summarized as "Sure, Trump might have done something bad, BUT WHAT ABOUT X"

Even if you are totally right that every other thing you listed is true and wrongful, that doesn't mean what Trump did wasn't bad, and it doesn't mean we shouldn't take Trump's potential crimes less seriously.

Quote (kalelvszod @ Nov 12 2019 04:11am)

Tru but has it been peoven 100% that there indeed was a quid pro quo? So far its all just hear say unless i missed something?not excusing trump or supporting him but the democrats are sore losers and been trying to impeach him since 1 hour after he won the election lol. The hypocrisy of the democrats just makes my blood boil thats all .

Quote (Thor123422 @ Nov 12 2019 05:18am)

There's a thread specifically for dumping transcripts of the hearings. Read up if you're really interested. There's a ton of first-hand witnesses, evidence that the Trump team intentionally altered the call transcript that they released, and specific orders from Trump to hold the already approved funds from going to Ukraine, and so much more. It's pretty damning honestly.

Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Nov 12 2019 01:26am)

0:40 Witness clearly saying there was a "quid pro quo", 1:25 Trump repeating there was no quid pro quo.
"quid pro quo" pretty clearly defined as a this for that: security money for an investigation on Biden.

"Crystal clear" ? You have no way out.