I'm talking more about the 2* shael instead of 2* 15/40 in the eth Tombreaver.

Non eth Tombreaver with 3*15/40 is 750 max dmg
Eth Tombreaver with zod + 2* shael is 850 max dmg

You need that 100% IAS even 95% isn't enough to realistically get you to 3 fpa.


But maybe the 3fpa is worth it over 4fpa with a 1200 max dmg weapon in pvp



Edit: with a Fana act 1 merc the equation changes and 3fpa is possible at 90% WIAS and 55% IAS

This post was edited by der_feine_herrr on Oct 25 2021 03:57pm

Yes someone else just posted this too.

It’s really interesting because Fana is a nice damage boost.

I still think potentially a Thunder Maul BotD could be better than eTomb if it can reach 4 frames. You can go Titan and take advantage of the 1.1x multiplier and get insane max damage. Or go Archon Staff and get super consistent average damage at 4 frames. Saves dex and nets more pts into str.

Ooo interesting build. I tried with horizons and failed miserably.

Firstly I just want to say great guide.

I just made a wolf barb and have 2 carrion rings for the twister stun. And then after playing a bit, I thought about doing a similar build.

How is it for pvm? Have you considered Atmas scarab for the amp? It would increase tornado effectiveness in PVM.

I'd love to see a video of you doing some PVM!


Also all this discussion on the off-hand ias has me thinking. I've been using a 3x Sheal non-eth tombreaver for my wolf barb.
How much off-hand ias would I need to hit 5 frames with oath?

Is the off-hand ias 1 for 1?

-65ias on Oath FA

I'd only need 40 off-hand ias for 5 frames?

This post was edited by organicgreens519 on Oct 25 2021 08:26pm

You can ofc use atma's for amp, and possible add in faith merc for even faster frames
Reapers merc triggers decreap pretty fast. And would override atma's amp.
So if u run atma's ammu you might as well go with faith merc.
With faith merc ur 50ias stormlash need 15off wep ias to reach 4/4/4/4/6 frames, below this ur at 4/4/4/4/7 frames.
85 gear ias ur at 4/4/4/4/5 frames.

Its also worth mentioning that with 30ias stormlash(eth zod) and faith merc + 50 off wep ias ur at 4/4/4/4/7 frames attack.

But i would recommend my initial build, with eth reapers merc.
What i did not mention about it is the deadly strike % which is actually 50+ %.
And that decreap aura from merc works wonders as crowd control.

I believe i finally understood the bear attack speed formula LOL xD

delay = [256*(WeaponBase + 1) / [(weapon ias+wsm+100)*256/100]]
"WeponBase from table, 19 for 1handswing, 17 for polearms etc, but we dont use +1... We just use the 17 and 19 etc"

prev frames = 10 or 9 (Bear or Wolf, respectively)
"yes, 10 for bear, knew this"

Anim speed = [prev frames * 256 / delay]
"Yeye, 10 for bear, knew this"

Speed increase = [120 * item_ias / (120 + item ias)] + skill ias + wsm
if (Speed increase > 75): Speed increase = 75
"Max break of 75 is removed in d2r.
But what i did not know is that here is:
item_ias = WepIas+OffwepIas"

WereBase = 11 or 12 (Bear or Wolf, respectively)
"yes looks good"

Frames = {256*(WereBase + 1)/[(100 + Speed increase)/100*Anim speed]} - 1
"looks good"

Excel formula bear Paw attacks:
Delay =ROUNDDOWN(256*WepBase/((WepIas+WSM+100)*256/100);0)
AnimSpeed =ROUNDDOWN(10*256/Delay;0)
Speedincrease =ROUNDDOWN(120*(GearIas+WepIas)/(120+(GearIas+WepIas));0)+SIAS+WSM
Frames =ROUNDUP(256*(11+1)/ROUNDDOWN((100+SpeedIncrease)/100*AnimSpeed;0);0)-1

So, ias is not worth anything almost^^ Espsially if u gonna hit 3 frames. Even 600ias wont help you.
However if u have 110ias GiantTresher, then 10ias helps u hit 4 frames.

SkillIas however has huge effect.
Lvl15 fana = 33SIAS.

110ias wep + lvl 15 fana = 3 frames attack (ias off wep has NO Effect)
110ias wep + lvl 9 fana = 3 frames attack as well (ias off wep has NO Effect)

Asssasins may reach 2 frames easy...
AIA1HT1 = 11 //// 208
Lvl 15 BOS = 50 SIAS

I couldn’t get through the math. I must be doing something wrong in excel.

Until we have a calculator, can you please check how much IAS Grear Poleaxe, Thunder Maul and Archon Staff need to hit 4 frames fury?

This post was edited by tcpgeest on Oct 26 2021 11:48am

OKi,

i have just spendt loads of hours to make 100% sure formulas are 100% correct.
And "item_ias = Wepias+GearIas" . This was more or less unoticible on d2lod, cause u need to run a ridicilous low werewolf level for it to matter. However it trigger breakpoints faster on d2r as SkillIncrease do infact get higher.

So this is the only change for fury formula.
Fury formula also contains werewolf paw attacks, such as standard attack and feral rage. However u need to add feral rage SIAS pr charge up ammount.
So the slow inital frame is the standard paw attack for werewolf.

This basicly means this build only need 20ias for the same frame attack, and i did not check much further than 55 gear ias and ur still at 4/4/4/4/6 frames.

But looking true all this shit i made werewolf biting attacks formula and verified it against d2lod calc(for the old breaks), to make sure its correct.
The only difference between biting attacks and regular paw attacks is that it use wereframe 10 instead of 13. (you still use 256 speed)

Bear biting attacks are the same as his paw attack formula 2 post above, but here you also use 10 as WereFrame. (its actually 13, but it does not do the 3 last, it does however play its sound)

Fireclaw actually use A2 attack according to a site, but there is no difference on the speed of A2 and A1 attack, so its regular paw speed. THe only difference i noticed is that i dont find the unshaped A2(HTH, BOW, XBOW)

Next time i will add the bear biting and paw attacks in excel, and verify them.

Then, with all the info i understood the last hours im fairly sure i can find all stuff needed for Shapechanged Barb, Assa etc.

And BOS bear ASSA = inzane speed now.
And Barb Feral Rage may be inzane as well, I dno.

People can also start to decide on builds:
90 ias tombreaver need 80 gear ias to reach 3/3/3/3/5 frames
95 ias tombreaver need 75 gear ias to reach 3/3/3/3/5 frames
100 ias tombraever need 0 gear ias to reach 3/3/3/3/5 frames, but reach 3/3/3/3/4 with 60 gear ias.
This was calculated with 74 werewolf SIAS. Below will be done with the same, there exists higher...




Would love u to inlcude wsm next time^^
Arcon STAFF 10 WSM = = Reaches 4/4/4/4/7 frames with 60wep ias and 30 gear ias. 80 off wep ias and ur 4/4/4/4/6
Great Polaxe is 0 WSM = Reaches 4/4/4/4/6 frames with 60wep ias and 0 gear ias. 100 off wep ias and ur 4/4/4/4/5
Thunder Maul is 20 WSM = Reaches 5/5/5/5/8 frames with 60wep ias and 0 gear ias. 75 off wep ias and ur 5/5/5/5/7

I guess that means BotD is better now than eTomb, unless you want to run a Faith merc.