Ah my bad

He means since Nixon

Or not?

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Oct 14 2019 03:12am

I thought Nixon was impeached as well but just read he resigned

Sorry, I'm not from the states so behind with USA history and politics

True. At the same time, he has far less appeal to the moderate or center-right suburban college-educated voters than Clinton. Bernie might have driven these people into Trump's camp. The electoral college map would have looked very different in Sanders/Trump than in Clinton/Trump. Also note that Bernie had very little appeal with African Americans. Against him, Trump would have needed to spend a lot less resources on holding NC and FL, and could have made a play for Virginia and Colorado instead.

Yeah no. Trump was the biggest deterrent to college educated voters in modern history. Also, I doubt many African Americans would have changed sides. They always go strongly Dem. Bernie also had plenty of pictures of him getting arrested marching during the civil rights movement to trot out.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Oct 14 2019 11:51am

hillary as a singular force, yes. but over the past 4 years Trump has supplanted that HRC hate with a steady stream of hate from all leftists. Nanci, Chuck, HRC herself, AOC, hollywood elites, etc. These streams of hate are filling whatever void HRC left imo. the calls to action the left constantly uses "impeach now", "we need to beat him in 2020, 1 term president", "racist, traitor, misogynist", etc. All of that is also a call to action to republicans.

also from a policy standpoint HRC was mundane and status quo. the DNC lineup in 2020 looks far more extreme to the average GOP voter.

it's not as pure of a motivation to get out and vote, but it might be as strong. time will tell.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 14 2019 11:56am

I'm not saying that these groups would have voted for Trump instead - all they needed to do was sit at home. The few couple of percentage points of African American turnout that Hillary dropped compared to Obama were already enough to cost her Michigan and Pennsylvania. Realistically, she was never gonna match Obama's AA turnout for... obvious reasons.

Also note that there were some nevertrumpers and conservative-leaning moderates who went with Hillary because they were so repulsed by Trump. Without those usually republican-voting people switching sides, she would have been swept away by Trump's huge wave of non-college white turnout and margins. These unusual votes for the Democratic candidate kept her in the race in the first place. If these college-educated, republican-leaning voters who ultimately broke for Hillary instead would have had to choose between Trump, whose manners and lies and lack of polish they found repulsive, and Bernie, whose agenda would have been financially disadvantageous for them, then it seems very plausible that a lot of them would have sat the election out or begrudgingly gone with Trump.

so its emerged that not only was Eric Ciaramella former NSC director for Ukraine turned CIA officer, but he traveled with Joe Biden on his trip to Ukraine as VP, and was directly involved in the correspondence Joe Biden had with the Ukrainians to hold up the foreign aid until Shokin got fired. And not only that, but Eric Ciaramella had been entangled with right-wing blogger (Cernovich) back in 2017 who accused him of being a leaker to advance a pro-Ukraine / anti-Russia agenda, which was the reason he stepped down from his NSC post citing 'harassment' and 'death threats' from Trump supporters.
http://archive.is/S3Ckp
if that guy isn't the whistleblower, then its incredible that there could exist another person with giant red arrows pointed at him like that
and if he is the whistleblower, it lends credence to the accusations he was the leaker in 2017;


so you've got a guy who had a close professional link to Biden, was intimately involved with Ukraine and held a hardcore pro-euromaidan agenda and was in a CIA white house position where he could listen in on Trump's phone calls. And as if he didn't already have a political bias to begin with, he's got every reason to be politically compromised and hate Trump enough to break the rules due to his perceived victimization. And you've got a whistleblower's who has already been 'confirmed' to have a close professional link to Biden, be conspicuously familiar with Ukrainian politics and hold a pro-euromaidan viewpoint and be a CIA officer and have conspicuous familiarity with Trump's phone calls in a way consistent with him previously having access to them until the white house started locking down with anti-leak measures, which the whistleblower cried foul about. And the whistleblower is confirmed to have broken the rules and acted with a political motive, and supports Biden. And the guy is also somehow known to news outlets who seem to have had no trouble figuring out who he was and confirm details about him, but won't publish them.


How could this not be the guy?

Lol... alright, I'm gonna say it:

"rigged witch hunt"



Neither his voters nor a sizable number of Republican Senators is gonna break with him over an impeachment process which began with such a hyperpartisan premise.