Well salvation is the most important topic of course and that one is quite debated. I made a thread about it not long ago here on d2jsp and there was immediately a fiery debate whether salvation is by faith and works, or faith alone with no chance of losing it. The Bible is not as clear as it should be on this issue, although I personally think that the osas doctrine rests upon a more solid biblical foundation. Some will disagree with me however.

I believed in God long before I read the Bible and I felt that Bible has a very unique power indeed.

John 14:6 - Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

Ephesians 2:8-9 - For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.

Is the Bible still not clear on this issue with you?

Yes.







These are but three examples, there are many more. God could just have stated it clearly, so that there would be no room for even a doubt, since it is so important.

This also. Requires a lot of intellectual acrobatics.

Let's look at the order. You are first saved and as a response to being saved you do good works. What this means is your motivation for doing good works isn't for self gain. You do not do good works in order that you are saved because you are already saved.

An example of this is God rescuing Israel from the Egyptians. The Israelite's were first saved and then they were given the law through Moses.

How can you say that you have faith and not show it by good works? It is very hard for somebody to convince you if they say that they have faith but do not show it in their works. This is known as the fruit of the Spirit.



When you say you have faith then show it to me without your good works and I will show you my faith by my good works. Again, I'm not doing this in order to be saved because I am already saved.

To the church of Laodicea:
They are neither cold or hot. This basically means they are lukewarm.
I am about to spit you out of my mouth.

^
Laodicea had the attitude of doing it all by myself without wanting your help.
Imagine bringing that kind of attitude to the Cross.
A long time ago Laodicea suffered from an Earthquake. Naturally after that you
have to rebuild everything. Yet Laodicea didn't want help as the people there
wanted to rebuild all by themselves.

The Laodiceans had an aqueduct that probably carried water from
hot mineral springs some five miles south, which would have
become tepid before entering the city, hence lukewarm.

http://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=71550713&f=119&o=0

Tell me truthfully, did you read from the beginning of Matthew 24? You know what I will do in reply if you put in a single verse out of context.

Also, with Philippians you posted a verse which starts with 'therefore' which means in conclusion. What that means is you should read what was written down prior to that verse.

I replied to James and Revelation because you posted more than one verse. Now do the same for the rest.

Well most Christians dont have good works since only a few are soul-winning and this is easily explained by simple math. Your idea of the gospel is very different. I have heard from many Christians that they were saved but lived a life full of sin. Not every Christian has good works.

"24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." I mean look at this verse, how can you say that the Bible is clear if you need so much explanation? It is only rendered logical because you do all this intellectual acrobatics. Yet in spite of this verse there are examples of people being saved in the Bible who were heavy sinners. Even before Jesus. David for instance, was a saved man yet he never knew about Jesus.

The Bible simply is not as clear and direct as it should be, therefore I doubt that it is handwritten by the Lord himself, the New Testament in particular, though its wisdom surpasses every other book indeed. It explains our moral universe.

What do you base that on? Do you base that on your own experiences? If so then perhaps you weren't around the mature Christians.

Or do you base that on Romans 3:10-12 King James Version (KJV)

10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

While many Christians may say they are saved but that is only the beginning. After they know they are saved then comes the response to being saved. Not every Christian has reached maturity. Heck I highly doubt that any Christian has ever reached full maturity.

The Bible is clear if you actually go through and study the text. If something doesn't make sense then you ask questions and demand an answer. So you said that a few people were saved even though they were heavy sinners, like David. Tell me then, what does that say about the grace of God in your words?

If you say The Bible is not clear, then go ahead and post every single Bible verse that doesn't make sense. Oh and do not just highlight a single verse in the middle of scripture. Instead post a few verses before and after the scripture in question.

Nah, nn intellectual acrobatics. I posted several texts, whole James 2. They are not out of context, I have read the Bible. The thing is, that the concept of salvation was a very diffuse one and the authors had different opinions about it. Early on they even wanted to exclude Paul's writings from the Bible. If you read the Bible it becomes very clear that Paul is so different from any other in the Bible.

And I base that on the fact that most people in the world has not heard the gospel. I listened to a pastor on youtube and he said most christians wont go out soul winning.

Just believing that God exists isn't enough. You have to believe that Jesus Christ as God in the flesh, died on the cross and rose from the dead for your sins and place your faith in Him for salvation.

As far as OSAS:

If you could lose your salvation, then you don't KNOW that you have eternal life:

1Jo 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may KNOW that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God (Emphasis Mine)

Believers are sealed by the Holy Spirit:

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

More later. I have to go to work.

Don't hurry