Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
I've finally got some time. Let's dissect what I by a "beggar nation" meant. Have a look how much every country benefits from EU etat:
https://i.ibb.co/tKWsjHR/eu-etat.pngNothing has changed up until today with the difference that Germany, France and Italy pay the part UK doesn't anymore. After 20 years of being in EU, getting funding, money and everything to allow business on your ground your country asks for the most amount of EU funds every year.
According to this chart, Belgium, Greece and Hungary get more money, yet they are only 30 million people, while we are 37mln people. So per capita they are bigger receivers. Didnt check other countries, but will probably find some more per capita.
Also 13bln eur per year is a lot, but not really absurdly high, as Poland spends 200bln eur every year. So its something like 6%. And we all know its going to get smaller soon.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
1) PiS get 38% votes in elections. Some of the opposition parties didnt reach the 8% threshold required to get into parliament, so their votes were nulled. Also in our voting rules, party with best score gets the "winner bonus". Not sure if its the same in Germany but this is quite common around the world.
2) Technically when you ask somebody to "repair damages" its not "begging". For example: Somebody damaged your car, you call the police, you sue him, the judge says he needs to repay you certain amount.
So you shouldnt call us beggars, lol.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
Back to PiS, members of that party are Apparatchiks who were forced to suck Russian d*** for a long time:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apparatchik They know how to "fake" a democracy, be corrupt, steal EU money then act as if everything would be alright. They're no better than Putin people suppressing people in Russia. You, your people let them make Poland authoritarian by bypassing judicative. The ruling party can pass any law without being afraid for being called unconstitutional. You said German judges are influenced the same which isn't true. We have a got a separate branch called "Bundesverfassungsgericht". Those judge's sole purpose is to see whether a verdict or a law is conforme with the constitution. An organ called "Verfassungsschutz" is there soleily to monitor whether Bundesverfassungsgericht is influenced in any way. To give you an example, protesters in the other thread in US who tried to make judge lives' hard by disturbing them during daily life would've been arrested without question for obstruction of the judicative. Your country is most similar to an ex east block country from USSR times than any eastern European EU member. Did you like Russian cock sucking so much during occupation? If not, why do you insist electing people who helped them suppress your people?
We want our neighbours to be ruled by a democratic rule in a democratic republic because we know if shit goes down the drain we'd also be in trouble.
Wrong again.
Our current leader, Kaczynski, was one of few highest brains behind the antirussian opposition. Walesa was the frontline leader, but he was just a good guy to speak to the crowds of people like him, workers. Kaczynski was the real brain.
Our current PM is a son of one of antirussian opposition leaders, who was imprisoned for years.
Our president was a kid 30 years ago
PiS is a branch of solidarity, antirussian opposition.
I already told you that polish judicial rules were changed to be similar to germany ones. Its correct that politicians have now some limited impact on judicial, which they didnt have in the past, but it aint big, and its to make necessary progress in the area.
People were really angry about judges "giving back" newly builded buildings in Warsaw to people who claim to be land owners 100 years ago. PiS scored some points on dealing with it, even if it meant touching the judicial.
Nothing to panic about.
I kind of like USA rules about consitutional courts: there you get elected for life. In Poland the term is 9 years, which means that party could gain majority there in just 3 years, if its lucky, or something like 5 years, if its not.
It was wrong imo, but what can I do? these 9 years were the rules when we entered EU, you guys could have tell us "its wrong, make it lifetime".
Look what happened in USA. Such a great country, yet they elected Trump, which is basically PiS, except that republican party was slowing him down.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
We want you to become first class citizens that's why our, French and Italian companies heavily invest in Poland while your "friend" Great Britain doesn't do so and even made Brexit partially because Brits were fed up with Polish immigration (just type in google "Polish immigrant Brexit", you'd wonder).
Well, nobody treats us as equal to them in Europe. like your posts calling us "beggars" without apparent reason. We are honest workers and people, not beggars god damnit.
It seems we are victims to racism, even more than black people because people often dont criticise black people because dont want to be/look racist.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
Your youth doesn't fight high percentage of unemployment like Spain during its crisis partially because they can work in Germany and elsewhere then come back.
I think its more because we:
1) used to earn less than spanish
2) dont have Euro, our currency got cheaper so our products became cheaper, while the spanish didnt.
Spanish people make much money from tourism, have a rich Catalonia region, and they could also go work somewhere else.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
All those rules are reasonable. Poland was a shithole run down by USSR 20 years ago. You came a long way. Where do you think did the money come from? Ask your grandpa/ grandma how they were living 20 years ago compared to today.
Communism fallen 33 years ago, not 20. It took us like 13 years to get accepted into EU, and to get ready with our laws and people.
The rules are not really always reasonable. Like we are working heavy to fight global warming in EU, while the rest of the world doesnt give a fuck and just enjoy life
If we didnt close the coal mines, we wouldnt have had energy problem this year in Poland, we were self dependant
I just really hope there will be a happy end to all of it, and we wont see a constant rise in prices, because of constant co2 reductions.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
Nope, I have to convey you unpoplar truth. Estonia and Estland made gigantic progress even though they joined the union much later. Strangely enough, they don't have a democracy problem or excessive costs implementing EU rule. From the POV of market economy, you don't mention how much money the EU saves your government and us all in general by solving administration in common grounds. GB is slowly experiencing the costs of all of those institution paid by a single country. Their prices are going to skyrocket even more during the next few years.
We dont really have democracy problem over here, we are having elections next year, it will be fair elections.
Public TV will be helping current party, but private TV are generally pro-opposition, one is openly anti-government, another one tries to be neutral but rather tends pro opposition. so it looks like even elections to me.
If the situation in Poland was bad, than the EU would cut the money, just as they do to Hungary now.
Quote (babun1024 @ 2 Oct 2022 19:25)
The last bit about the lack of knowledge in Poland. The industrial heart of Europe is located between south Germany, western France, Northern Italy and Swiss. 99% products related to high level production and chemical industry are located there. Italy's problem is more its industry in Lombardy region than some immigration problem in south were the productivity is near zero. South Italy is to Northern Italians the same as Poland to EU with the difference Poland has got an actual potential to become a net contributer sometimes in the future. Lots of German companies create supplier companies in Poland for gear parts and more. The highest paying EU members who keep the union afloat are:
Germany
France
Italy
In that order. The others are far behind in contribution. Sweden populace pays the highest EU membership fees per capita. Those regions I mentioned stopped production as of now because their products aren't competitive price wise. Energy costs are driving production costs too high to be rentable. If those regions continue to be closed due to lack of gas and high electricity costs, then all of the EU is going to be in a recession. Poland which doesn't contribute anyways would be screwed even more. See where I come from? It's not Germany's problem alone, all of the EU is going to go down the drain.
Please see
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_BananaI know its not a Germany problem only. But one of the reasons is that EU shut up or doesnt build Nuclear Plants. Another one: we shut up coal in EU. Instead we relied on unreliable russian gas, and subject to russian sabbotage. It was 3 wrong decisions it seems.