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Oct 22 2019 07:34pm
We haven't had a solid Yang Gang post in a while, so let's hop to it.

171 years ago, in 1848, Karl Marx accurately predicted our modern era of automation, artificial intelligence, and the solutions as prescribed by our beloved Democratic hopeful Andrew Yang.

Marx was no opponent of automation. In fact, he accurately describes it as a necessary stage in capitalist development on the road toward communism. He didn't care for folklore tales like John Henry; Marx was rooting for the steam drill.

Below are excerpts from 'The Fragment on Machines' which can be read in full here: http://thenewobjectivity.com/pdf/marx.pdf

Quote
Once adopted into the production process of capital, the means of labour passes through different metamorphoses, whose culmination is the… automatic system of machinery… set in motion by an automaton, a moving power that moves itself; this automaton consisting of numerous mechanical and intellectual organs, so that the workers themselves are cast merely as its conscious linkages.


This is still a bit ahead of its time even today, as all workers haven't completely transitioned into mere "conscious linkages" assisting the AI run machines.

Quote
Rather, it is the machine which possesses skill and strength in place of the worker, is itself the virtuoso, with a soul of its own in the mechanical laws acting through it; and it consumes coal or oil just as the worker consumes food to keep up its perpetual motion.


Marx extols the replacement of the worker in the capital system by machines.

Quote
Labour no longer appears so much to be included within the production process; rather, the human being comes to relate more as watchman and regulator to the production process itself… As soon as labour in the direct form has ceased to be the great well-spring of wealth, labour time ceases and must cease to be its measure.

Capitalism thus works towards its own dissolution as the form dominating production.


Marx admits here that the labor theory of value ends when the automated future arrives.

Quote
Capital itself is the moving contradiction... it presses to reduce labour time to a minimum, while it posits labour time, on the other side, as sole measure and source of wealth.


And we see this happening all around us today. Hours and benefits are being cut wherever possible by those who currently control capital in order to maximize their accumulation of capital, but as demand drives economic production and demand relies wholly on labor being compensated for time, the economy is grinding to a halt at the bottom even as economic indicators at the top indicate extreme health. Eventually the entire system will end itself. Automation is an accelerant.

Marx does lay out a utopian view of how this all ends,

Quote
...the general reduction of the necessary labour of society to a minimum, which corresponds to the artistic, scientific etc. development of the individuals in the time set free, and with the means created, for all of them.


How we arrive there is a choice that our current generation will likely have to make. Either violent revolution and mass social upheaval will occur as the capital system grinds to a halt, or we embrace the end point as soon as possible and start paying out a Universal Basic Income that gradually increases until the machines have supplanted labor in its entirety.

My family stands by the immediate objectives of candidate Yang. Where does yours stand?

This post was edited by inkanddagger on Oct 22 2019 07:40pm
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Oct 22 2019 10:08pm
Whether it's upheaval or ubi we are all moving towards centralization. This centralization will end up with a global type government and all the plebs will line up to support it so they can get their measly handouts.

Money is not the objective, control is the objective. The Bezos's of the world will end up ruling us. They already do to some extent, but it will be even more pronounced when shit hits the fan with a massive war(s) and they consolidate control afterwards.
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Oct 22 2019 10:17pm
Quote (ofthevoid @ Oct 22 2019 11:08pm)
Whether it's upheaval or ubi we are all moving towards centralization. This centralization will end up with a global type government and all the plebs will line up to support it so they can get their measly handouts.

Money is not the objective, control is the objective. The Bezos's of the world will end up ruling us. They already do to some extent, but it will be even more pronounced when shit hits the fan with a massive war(s) and they consolidate control afterwards.


Centralization is unavoidable as communication and travel become easier. We saw consolidation of the major European powers and the continental United States with the invention of the railroad. We are overdue for a new wave of national consolidation now that flights and the internet are commonplace.
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Oct 23 2019 02:01am
Quote (Thor123422 @ 23 Oct 2019 06:17)
Centralization is unavoidable as communication and travel become easier. We saw consolidation of the major European powers and the continental United States with the invention of the railroad. We are overdue for a new wave of national consolidation now that flights and the internet are commonplace.


Flights will only be available until the ecosocialist world government outlaws them (ofc just for the bottom 99%).
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Oct 23 2019 04:53am
Yang 2020
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Oct 23 2019 05:34am
You are turning things so dramatically OP, in fact, in practice, the automation progress is not instant and several generations of humans already adapted to it.
What could be important, however, is a constant social support for professional training & education, better regulation to protect workers...
If your gang band Yang only offers flat and stupid money then it's just wrong and A PLAIN STUPID WASTE.
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Oct 23 2019 06:50am
labor displacement vs labor replacement.

when dumb people talk about the baseball seemer its evident they dont understand the above. historically when technological advancements come and displace labor the overall labor pool is still empty enough to soak them up. also, when they were let go (predominately from factor work) there were always other factories using similar skills paying similar pay. the pay was low. compared to today where the overall labor pool can't just absorb entire sectors, people are losing high paid jobs, and their skills aren't translatable elsewhere.

the future will bring lots of anti robot sentiments. i predict that by the year 2030 one of the major 2 parties (my guess is GOP) will be filled with streaks of anti robot platform running politicians. they'll cater to the ideals of an older generation taught the only way to live a good life is a back breaking day of labor with 2 days off per week.
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Oct 23 2019 07:05am
Quote (thesnipa @ 23 Oct 2019 08:50)
labor displacement vs labor replacement.

when dumb people talk about the baseball seemer its evident they dont understand the above. historically when technological advancements come and displace labor the overall labor pool is still empty enough to soak them up. also, when they were let go (predominately from factor work) there were always other factories using similar skills paying similar pay. the pay was low. compared to today where the overall labor pool can't just absorb entire sectors, people are losing high paid jobs, and their skills aren't translatable elsewhere.

the future will bring lots of anti robot sentiments. i predict that by the year 2030 one of the major 2 parties (my guess is GOP) will be filled with streaks of anti robot platform running politicians. they'll cater to the ideals of an older generation taught the only way to live a good life is a back breaking day of labor with 2 days off per week.



i think they already made this movie it’s called I Robot :lol:
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Oct 23 2019 07:25am
Quote (excellence @ Oct 23 2019 08:05am)
i think they already made this movie it’s called I Robot :lol:


iRobot or Terminator! my first xbox live names was iBrobot. lol to be 16 again and think that kind of stuff was clever.

Quote (djman72 @ Oct 23 2019 08:41am)
Mintergreendip94

Yeah, that was my Xbox 360 name.


wowza. lol the numbers on the end, so 2000s.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 23 2019 08:19am
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Oct 23 2019 07:41am
Quote (thesnipa @ Oct 23 2019 08:25am)
iRobot or Terminator! my first xbox live names was iBrobot. lol to be 16 again and think that kind of stuff was clever.


Mintergreendip94

Yeah, that was my Xbox 360 name.
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