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Jun 14 2018 11:03am
Quote (Goomshill @ Jun 14 2018 09:49am)
because of the incoherent motivations. I can understand J Edgar Hoover being a power tripping fascist out to persecute political dissenters and activists while developing his own fourth (fifth?) estate. He was a monster but he was consistent.
being willing to torture the protocols by bending them as far as you can get away with is standard operating procedure and I've always just taken it as a given all the agencies are filled with political actors. Flagrantly breaking the protocols in full public view? How often does that happen?

Comey in 2016 was notable because he managed to piss off both sides so publicly with no apparent benefit to himself. He had every opportunity to hush up the Clinton investigation if he was her catspaw, or to skewer her if he was throwing his weight in with Trump. Yet his self-immolation days before the election made his own dismissal guaranteed no matter what the outcome, and evaporated all his political capital. That's not the actions of anyone's crony or an aspiring spy-king.


so to me that means he's an honarable guy who didn't like working in a govt that was aflame. the prospect of being the director to either Trump or HRC wouldn't interest him from any standpoint imo. so he exposed what he could with some dirty tactics then ensured he'd be fired by whomever won so he could remain honorable.
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Jun 14 2018 11:06am
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/14/us/politics/fbi-inspector-general-comey-trump-clinton-report.html
kinda skint with only one new detail, but its an interesting one;

Quote
The inspector general said that, because of his views, Mr. Strzok may have improperly prioritized the Russia investigation over the Clinton investigation during the final weeks of the campaign.
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Jun 14 2018 11:08am
Aka Comey was a piece of shit but he wasnt politically motivated, just afraid of HRC
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Jun 14 2018 11:10am
Quote (Goomshill @ Jun 14 2018 10:59am)


the Clinton investigation into the emails and deleted servers? which was mostly redundant emails collected off Wiener's laptop, on the subject of something that was in the past, although potentially a crime she got away with.

vs

the Trump investigation, which was ongoing and not a re-open, into a campaign that was potentially committing ongoing crimes.

it's nuanced, but think of the end results of both investigations if either was found guilty.

IF HRC is found out after the election, it's a crime, she get's impeached. but the crime was pre-election, and litigated to the point all people knew the truth more or less except far left "im with her" types.

IF Trump is found out, it's a crime, he get's impeached. But they only won in part due to that hypothetical crime, that a large part of the electorate actively denies happened.


i hate trump and HRC, i'd prioritize a potentially active crime over a zombie redundant investigation too, although neither should be swept under the rug.

Quote (EndlessSky @ Jun 14 2018 11:08am)
Aka Comey was a piece of shit but he wasnt politically motivated, just afraid of HRC


he leaked on HRC, ensuring his firing, because he was afraid of her? walk me thru that

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jun 14 2018 11:11am
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Jun 14 2018 11:44am
Quote (thesnipa @ Jun 14 2018 01:10pm)
the Clinton investigation into the emails and deleted servers? which was mostly redundant emails collected off Wiener's laptop, on the subject of something that was in the past, although potentially a crime she got away with.

vs

the Trump investigation, which was ongoing and not a re-open, into a campaign that was potentially committing ongoing crimes.

it's nuanced, but think of the end results of both investigations if either was found guilty.

IF HRC is found out after the election, it's a crime, she get's impeached. but the crime was pre-election, and litigated to the point all people knew the truth more or less except far left "im with her" types.

IF Trump is found out, it's a crime, he get's impeached. But they only won in part due to that hypothetical crime, that a large part of the electorate actively denies happened.


i hate trump and HRC, i'd prioritize a potentially active crime over a zombie redundant investigation too, although neither should be swept under the rug.



he leaked on HRC, ensuring his firing, because he was afraid of her? walk me thru that


He changed to wording of law to prevent her prosecution
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Jun 14 2018 11:53am
Quote (EndlessSky @ Jun 14 2018 11:44am)
He changed to wording of law to prevent her prosecution


i said walk me through it not point and mutter "that way".

why would someone who's afraid of HRC drop the Wiener news? I have plenty of ideas, some which include him being afraid of HRC (although i dont put much faith in them), i just don't know what you mean nor how or if it applies to this more recent report.
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Jun 14 2018 12:24pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Jun 14 2018 01:53pm)
i said walk me through it not point and mutter "that way".

why would someone who's afraid of HRC drop the Wiener news? I have plenty of ideas, some which include him being afraid of HRC (although i dont put much faith in them), i just don't know what you mean nor how or if it applies to this more recent report.


He was also afraid of losing his job, which would happen if it was found out he hid that news. The weiner drop was less of a direct attack against Hillary and could be made to look as a coincidence if he had to confront Hillary after the election.
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Jun 14 2018 12:30pm
Quote (EndlessSky @ Jun 14 2018 12:24pm)
He was also afraid of losing his job, which would happen if it was found out he hid that news. The weiner drop was less of a direct attack against Hillary and could be made to look as a coincidence if he had to confront Hillary after the election.


well.... he'd "lose his job if they found out he hid that news" if Trump won, which I don't think was a large part of his motivation. but maybe Comey always believed in Trump. unless u think that HRC would fire Comey if it leaked post an HRC-win that Comey helped HRC win.

the reality of the Wiener case is that rogue supporters in the FBI were working with the campaign and were going to leak the wiener investigation no matter what, Comey made his address to beat them to the punch and avoid his FBI looking as leaky as it was. Rudy Guiliani all but confirmed this.

but i don't think that Comey was interested in being the FBI director for either Trump or HRC.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jun 14 2018 12:30pm
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Jun 14 2018 04:31pm
https://www.justice.gov/file/1071991/download
I haven't had much time to read any of it, but just now I got a few minutes to read through pages 329+ where it describes the genesis of the Weiner laptop evidence and Comey's decision making in going public
Essentially TLDR: The OIG found no credible explanation for why the laptop was suppressed and rejected every excuse given to him by the FBI agents and said they were all bullshit. But he also found no proof of it being suppressed intentionally. So rather than give some authoritative conclusion to the question of how the laptop managed to stay invisible for a month, it just says that McCabe/Strzok had it and failed to follow up on it even though they had every logical reason and natural step to do so, and their excuses about jurisdiction / low interest were bogus. But again, no actual proof of wrongdoing. So the OIG leaves that one up in the air, proof that they didn't act responsibily, not proof they acted maliciously.
Comey's decision to go public lays out his explanation for his reasoning very much consistent with what we talked about above;

Quote
I couldn’t see a door—I said to the people inside the organization—I
can’t see a door labeled, no action here. I can only see two doors and
both were actions. One is speak, the other is conceal. Because having
testified about this multiple, multiple times, like working backwards in
September, July and having spoken about it on July 5th, and told
Congress, the American people, a material fact which is, this is done
and there is no there there. To now restart and not just in a marginal
way, in a way where we may have found the missing emails, that to
not speak about that would be, in my view, an affirmative act of
concealment. And so I said okay, those are the doors. One says
speak, the other says conceal. Let’s see what’s behind the speak door.
It’s really bad. We’re 11 days from a presidential election. Given the
norm I’ve long operated under, that’s really bad. That will bring such
a storm. Okay, close that one, really bad. Open the second one.
Catastrophic. And again this is something reasonable people can
disagree about, but my view was to conceal at that point given all I
had said would be catastrophic. Not just to the Bureau, but beyond
the Bureau and that as between catastrophic and really bad, that’s
actually not that hard a choice. I’ll take really bad over catastrophic
any day. And so I said to the team, welcome to the world of really
bad.

...

Yeah, so I’m sitting there. It’s October 27th and there’s a reasonable
likelihood that we are going to find material—one possibility—that will
change our view of the Hillary Clinton case. Two, even if it doesn’t,
that we know something that is materially different than what the rest
of the world knows and has relied upon since I spoke about this....
The FBI is done. There is no there there and that to conceal that, in
my view, would be—subject the FBI and the Justice Department,
frankly more broadly...to a corrosive doubt that you had engineered a
cover up to protect a particular political candidate. And that especially
given your pledges of transparency, not—I don’t actually put much
stock in the notion that I promised to get back to Congress, but that I
had said to everybody, the credibility of the Justice enterprise is
enhanced by maximal credibility, maximal transparency. I offer that
transparency, and then I know something that materially changes that
picture and I hide it, I think the results would be generations-long
damage to the credibility of the FBI and the Justice Department.
That’s what I think about it.


Quote
[T]he overriding question was say nothing and get accused, worst case
scenario, of covering up. Or be transparent and say we have
something, we just don’t know what it is, and let that course play out.
And I, you know, again, I, I describe the Director as a very
transparent, communicative...person. And I want to say that that
transparent piece probably weighed on him more than the not saying
anything piece. And also I think his, his belief that he had somehow
made that pledge to Congress.


and finally:

Quote
[N]ot to notify Congress is...an action because it also potentially could
have an impact on the election...so for example, [imagine] we don’t
say anything. We push past the election, and then we announce that,
well, by the way, we’ve authorized a search warrant, and we found all
these emails. Let’s imagine, right? Because we don’t know what the
facts are.
We find all these emails. You guys have probably heard this story, but
I’ll just say it again. And it turns out that, oh, my God, there were
more classified emails of a different type, or there’s clear evidence that
she knew what she was doing. It kind of pushes us from the probable
cause thing up to the beyond a reasonable doubt. And now we’re
going to change our view about charging her.... If she’s been elected
president of the United States, then Donald Trump would say, oh my
God, these people knew this beforehand and didn’t say anything. This
is a rigged system. This is, this, these people intentionally hid that
until after the election so that they could get her elected and, and
thwart me.
Steinbach also stated a similar concern. He stated:
I think weighing on everyone’s mind is if, if we get through this and a
week after the general election we find relevant material, the Congress
and the American public will never allow the FBI to live that down.
You clearly hid this from the American public. And you knew you had
something, yet you waited until after, until after she became president
before you disclosed that you found something relevant. That was one
course of action. The other course of action is we, we state it and get
accused of influencing the election beforehand.

We felt that, again, the, the Congress, the American people, would
never be able to say FBI, you withheld this. The last thing we wanted
to have happen was, hey, I wouldn’t have voted for her if I had known
this. And so that was weighing on our minds. We wanted there to be
transparency, both in November as well as in, in July. Hey, here is the
set of facts. Here is the good and the bad. You, and again, I think
that’s, there’s somebody, many feel that’s not your job, but I think the
discussion items were, lay out the facts and let people decide for
themselves. And that, and maybe not in those exact words, that was
a theme through the course of this.
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Jun 14 2018 04:36pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Jun 14 2018 03:31pm)
https://www.justice.gov/file/1071991/download
I haven't had much time to read any of it, but just now I got a few minutes to read through pages 329+ where it describes the genesis of the Weiner laptop evidence and Comey's decision making in going public
Essentially TLDR: The OIG found no credible explanation for why the laptop was suppressed and rejected every excuse given to him by the FBI agents and said they were all bullshit. But he also found no proof of it being suppressed intentionally. So rather than give some authoritative conclusion to the question of how the laptop managed to stay invisible for a month, it just says that McCabe/Strzok had it and failed to follow up on it even though they had every logical reason and natural step to do so, and their excuses about jurisdiction / low interest were bogus. But again, no actual proof of wrongdoing. So the OIG leaves that one up in the air, proof that they didn't act responsibily, not proof they acted maliciously.
Comey's decision to go public lays out his explanation for his reasoning very much consistent with what we talked about above;





and finally:


Do you think it'll end up being a wash to where neither side can fully embrace it and everyone moves on?

At this point with what you've seen where do you see this ending up
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