I know the game is pretty much dead so this might be pointless but I was cleaning out my pc and forgot that I had come up with this guide about 3 to 4 years ago.
I was bored and threw it together. I don't know how relevent people would think of it now but i figured why the hell not. Here it is:
Probably one of the biggest arguments over the past few years in the dueling community is whether or not Barb vs Barb duels can be considered real duels. While I am in the category of yes that they should, it doesn't remove the fact that you have strong pundits against these arguments that have some merit. The rest are just trolls who rely on f-mod and other available tweaks to allow them an experience to be competitive. The reason people turned to Barb vs Barb duels is because even with f-mod and other hacks, it will not interfere with the actual outcome of the duel itself which is ironic considering that this cannot really be said about any other character class. The only exception to my last statement would be auto healing of any type which is considered an automatic loss to most of the barb vs barb purists (at least on east). Now that we have gotten that out of the way let us continue.
The major concept in most b-v-b duels it to be able to tank total damage and to be able to give out more than you receive (really !?). Yeah I know that this is such a ground breaking concept but let us look a little deeper. Since there are a very many barb types we will go through the standard barb set ups as well as some of the gear associated with them.
Barb Types
1. Traditional or Defense B-v-B: This would require the use of an Ornate, Pavise or Grim shield, Grim helmet or Grand crown, War or Battle Gauntlets, War belt or a very high end Battle belt, a 1 handed weapon (generally an Exec, Battle hammer, or Naga), and then the rest of the gear is standard (from patch 1.10 and beyond anyway). The standard gear is a pair of Goblin Toes, and 3 parts of the Angelic set (2 rings and an amulet). The idea is to maximize your defensive capabilities as well as your statistics through your chosen gear in order to have both the highest damage output and attack rating possible (to assist in the damage output) all while having the highest defensive capabilities possible. Most of the recent barb vs barb duels will only accept this type of format as this is considered the most standard of practices.
2. The Bleeder: This would require the use of your choice of weapon in conjunction with a Twitch and Sword back Hold spiked shield. The twitch allows for increased blocking with the sword back and the sword back give the dueler a chance to slowly bleed out the opponent’s life over time. The rest of the gear can be a combination of the standard gear with a choice of specific helmets, gloves, and belts that can either be rare, socketed, unique, and/or set items. I have seen a bleeder employ a 3 socketed helmet, blood fists, and a very nice rare low strength requirements belt. I have also seen some that use Sigon’s set for the belt and helmet (for additional attack rating) as well as some that used all rare items for the various equipment slots. The constants for this build are the armor and the shield.
3. The Clegger: The gear choice for this barb is almost identical to that of a bleeder with 2 distinct differences. The first is the weapon as Cleglaw’s Sword and Cleg’s gloves. With these two pieces of the set together, the weapon of the set increases in damage as the level of the character grows. The second benefit is that the gloves allow for the ability to slow the opponent to limit the opponent’s movement in order to maximize the bleeding effect and to also aide in attacking an opponent out of position.
4. The Lifer: This is almost the same as a defense build barb versus barb but the only added effect is the use of strength glitching to put on all of the gear. This allows milking as much life as possible from the build to help aide in the duels. There is risk associated with this method because you can potentially lose your gear if you die more than once or are “pk”ed by those who frown on this type of dueling. When you do eventually go and pick up your bodies or are forced to leave the game and join a new one, you can lose the equipment that was glitched on.
5. The hybrid: This build allows for a barb to switch between main defense and bleed set ups. Most of the time, a defense barb with the 2 bleed pieces can more than hold their own against a traditional bleeder . The reason for this is that while a bleeder can do decent amount of damage, they are more of a life focus build. While the defense barb may not have as much life as a traditional bleeder, they have a higher damage output generally so it would boil down to the skill of the combatants.
6. The CB Barb: This is mainly a mold of the defense build but with the exception being that instead of an ornate plate, the player uses a rattle cage armor to increase the likelihood of a crushing blow connection. While this build can be effective with battle hammers it is better for those using ranged weapons such as an Executioners sword or a Naga. The added range allows for maximum damage output when going up against the battle hammer barbs who would generally have the highest damage output but the weakest range.
There are other builds as well but these are the ones that you will find most often, especially for those who are B-v-B exclusive.
General Skill tree
Your skills should look something like this:
1. Max weapon mastery in the weapon of choice being used
2. Max whirlwind
3. Max battle orders
4. Max shout
5. 1 skill into battle commands
6. As much if not max into Iron Skin
7. Some skills into speed (mainly for the range users, Bleeders, and Clegger builds). Increase speed may slightly increase the whirlwind movement speed but does not add to any additional whirlwind damage. The advantage here is that the whirlwinds may be harder to time because of the increased animation speed of the said whirlwind.
Other skills may be employed here but these are your main focuses for barb vs barb duels. Obviously the higher the level the more skills you will have filled out so make sure that you are using the skills appropriate to your build and play style.
When to use cold damage and how to counter it
There has been a long standing debate on various elemental uses and which are most effective or least effective when it pertains to dueling. The biggest debate comes in the form of cold damage. While cold damage can be effective, it is only generally so if you are going in a direct cross whirlwind against your opponent. If this is not the case then it would be more detrimental using it than not unless you have range. By incorporating range i.e. Exec and Naga versus a battle hammer barb, you are able to keep the hammer barb outside of his range while inflicting damage. While some may use rules against range in combination with cold damage (See Europes b-v-b rules), it is not an unconquerable thing. The easiest way to beat cold damage is to use it against your opponent. Since classic bvb does not factor in combined character IAS into whirlwind damage, all cold damage does is slow down the whirlwind movement and not its actual damage production. If you are able to effectively read your opponent and shoot off a whirlwind in front of him as he is in the middle of one himself, he will connect and run right over top of you. The difference is that he will also connect with cold damage, slowing you down all while he is running as a standard whirlwind speed. By slowing your whirlwind speed down and not the damage, you are inflicting more damage in the exchange than he is and the cd user would have no choice but to take it. The only advantage is as the exchange ends, if he has a higher range, you could eat a shot at the tail end of it that he wouldn’t. However the damage the cd user receives will generally be more than what the cd user’s damage output would be. Timing, movement, and patience are going to be key in how you deal with cold damage.
Running or Walking
Another debate is in the running versus walking when it comes to duels. If you are a range user then it might be more effective for you to be running nonstop as it would allow for you to pick and choose your shots and catch your opponents out of position where you can maximize your damage. We all know that bleeders will do nothing but run because this is how they accumulate damage and maximize their builds in general. Walking though allows for an increased chance of blocking. This would be the only reason for it. The only other way to increase your blocking chance further than walking is to always whirlwind from a standing position. This is not really all that recommended as you will chew through your mana and can make yourself an easy target for your opponent. It also will make you predictable.
All about the Angles
When you are bvbing there are some out there that can and will complain about movement. They call it “dancing” and it annoys them because you don’t present yourself as an easy target. I usually scoff at this because this is a big part of what good bvb is all about. This isn’t simply just spinning through or past your opponents repeatedly until one of them falls. It is also about large amounts of feigning and being unpredictable to keep your opponents from teeing off on you as well as allowing you to catch them off guard for a win. I have noticed, especially with ranged weapon users, that a lot of barbs are basically counter punchers. They wait for you to make a move first in order to capitalize on it. This is especially true with bleeder barbs. They don’t want to get caught in the range of a battle hammer because this is where they get hurt and die. Because of this, feigns and odd angles are beneficial to those barbs who prefer the battle hammer. It can disrupt the timing of the range users and make it more difficult for them to use their range effectively. While you do this you can pick up on the tendencies of your opponent and time them in such a way as to angle into their range, in which you maximize your impact on the duel. If you can keep the opponent within your range you can effectively wipe them out if they are using ranged weapons vs a weapon like a bhammer with no range to it.
Dealing with Range, CD, Slow, and Bleed
Forcing the opponent to “ride” whirlwinds is the essential strategy to circumventing the effectiveness of range. It is also one of the only effective strategies in dealing with bleeders, cleggers, and cold damage. If both opponents are using a weapon with the same range, sometimes it is picking up on specific angles that will allow a player to just connect better against an opponent. For those who are specifically defense barbs I say this. Grab a twitch and a sword back. If you have a bleeder that thinks he is unbeatable, equip these and duel him. Chances are you could win as much as you lose. By using bleed gear against him you essentially take the concept of bleed completely out of the equation. By doing this is essentially eliminate his only real advantage other than life. Then it becomes more of a game of skill and who can get off the better shots and take out the opponent. This concept of riding whirlwinds and forcing the opponent to ride along with you is one of the more difficult abilities to be efficient with. Now I am not a game physics master or a programmer so I cannot speak to the actual programming of this game and how the characters and attack animations may or may not aide in these angles in any way. I am speaking from over 10 years of experience and this is what I am drawing on in the creation of this guide.
Gear Attributes
I am addressing gear other than the standard gear (angelics and goblin toes). This also includes the twitch, sword back, other set gear, or socket gear as used by bleeders/cleggers. This also doesn’t touch on the prepatched gear that is out there. Basically this is a rare gear rundown and what to look for.
1. Helmets: You generally want as close to 40 life as possible here. You also should be looking for additional attack rating, whether it be 15, 30, or 5%. Depending on the weapon or build, your sockets would generally be either ruby for more life, amethyst for more strength, or emeralds for more dexterity. Grim helmets and Grand crowns are usually the gear of choice here due to the higher defense.
2. Shields: The first 2 mods should be a no brainer and this is the 30/20 mod. This will be needed for any shield to maximize blocking potential with the exception being sword backs in conjunction with a twitch. The major mods you want are either strength or max. If you are lucky enough you can get both on the same shield. Other minor mods that can be effective are attack rating, attacker takes damage, replenish life, and damage reduced by. The sockets for shields are most commonly an amethyst for increased defense or a skull for increase damage taken by an attacker. I lean more toward the amethyst but the skull can be effective. The 2 shield types are either a Pavise or a Grim shield. Pavises have a higher natural percentage to block over the Grim but the Grim shield will have superior defense.
3. Ornates: With ornate plates the effectiveness of the armor is first predicated on defense. The higher it is the better. My rule of thumb is that it has at least 888 in total defense or in other words, 97% or higher enhanced defense. The exception to this is if you are a ranged weapon user in which case you can get away with slightly less. The other important mods are base life, strength, and dexterity. These will help to increase your chances of survival as well as help with damage output, increased defense, and attack rating. Dexterity is essential for those who wish to go with executioner swords. Some minor mods that come in handy on this equipment are attack rating, damage reduced, replenish life, and attacker takes damage. The most common sockets associated with Ornates are either amethyst for strength, emeralds for dexterity, or rubies for life.
4. Belts: The 2 main mods you want on a belt are strength and life. The closer you are to 20 strength and 60 life the better your barb can potentially become. I didn’t include defense here because of the fact that some barb types don’t need defense as much as they need the mods on lower strength required gear. For the purposes of defense and crushing blow barbs, defense is also important. Other minor but effective mods include attack rating, attacker takes damage, replenish life, and damage reduced. The belt types differs depending on barb type but the general rule is that defense barbs use War or Battle belts while bleeders use Demon hide or Sharkskin belts.
5. Gloves: There are 3 main mods you need to look for here. The first is strength. You want to close to 9 as possible, if not 9. The second is dexterity and again, this is as close to 15 as possible if not 15. The third would be attack rating being as close to 20. It is possible to get both attack rating as well as attack rating percentage increase together on the same pair of gloves. This is extremely rare and hard to find with the above mentioned must have mods. There aren’t many bonus mod attributes that can be added to gloves as IAS has no bearing on classic bvb.
Random observations:
I have noticed and tested a couple of different things that I figured should be pointed out. These are just my experiences so if anyone else has a difference of opinion or experience, please share.
1. Unless the weapon has skills on it poison damage seems to interfere with the connection of crushing blow. I have tested this on east with 4 different players over a stretch of months when I started to see this and they all have noticed this as well when I pointed it out.
2. Skill weapons allow for the increased chance of critical strikes. Do not confuse critical strikes with crushing blow as they are different things. This can and will increase the chances of winning the duel.
3. The major difference between Europe and East in b-v-b duels are the BO set ups. Europe frowns on full BO before duels where East practices the maximum BO standard. I cannot speak for Europe but on East we do this to take the skill weapons out of the equation in pre buff situations in order to truly find out who the better duelers are. This is just the philosophy East has employed since patch 1.10.
4. FHR is pointless in barb vs barb duels unless one thing happens. IF you are attacked by a weapon coming out of a whirlwind that has fire damage on it and it takes effect, it will cause the stun animation to start up which is about a frame or 2. This is about the only time that FHR would even be viable in these types of duels.
5. Although it doesn’t look like it in game, Nagas and Execs share the same range. I don’t know why people either do not believe it or don’t think that is the case but it is true. They are classified with the weapon range of 3 while a battle hammer has a weapon range of 1. I believe that the Cleg sword is a range of 2 but that would have to be looked up.
I won’t go into specific stats on these builds as the stats will be based on the gear you use or personal preference but my suggestion is to get the gear for the character you plan on building first so that you can map out what you want to do with it.
Thanks for reading and I hope that this guide can be of use to some of you. Thank you and I appreciate feedback.
-Booogeyman
This post was edited by Booogeyman on Jul 19 2016 01:48pm