d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate > Russia / Ukraine
Prev1479047914792479347945001Next
Closed New Topic New Poll
Member
Posts: 18,358
Joined: Jan 8 2022
Gold: 22,843.67
Mar 3 2025 02:47pm
which decisions are you referencing, and why is it good for the USA to influence them? genuinely curious.

it was in our interest objectively to convince them to boost their defense budgets when we produced nearly all their arms. if they move on it's a nonissue at best especially if we leave NATO.


Decisions on whether to buy American equipment or French equipment, for example.
Member
Posts: 56,398
Joined: Jan 19 2007
Gold: 585,113.49
Mar 3 2025 02:49pm
Correct, the USA has a lot of techy items, but we're not producing shells/artillery at the rate we arguably should. last i heard we have about 8 days (estimated) of shells if we play out a wargame on china. then we're out.



this is a terrible analogy. to be correct it would be like saying "a child lives at home but pays 500$/month rent. they move out, this is bad financially for the parents". you can make moral arguments for self reliance, but losing a paying customer is never good, nor is bolstering your competition. handing over sales to france isnt in the US's interest, financially.



per google. not living and dying by these numbers but its a google result id guess is roughly correct.



which decisions are you referencing, and why is it good for the USA to influence them? genuinely curious.

it was in our interest objectively to convince them to boost their defense budgets when we produced nearly all their arms. if they move on it's a nonissue at best especially if we leave NATO.


what type of manufacturing ? weapons?
Member
Posts: 92,973
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Mar 3 2025 02:53pm
Decisions on whether to buy American equipment or French equipment, for example.


id hope we never do that. talk about a scum move, shaking down nations to force them to buy your stuff. thats yucky.

what type of manufacturing ? weapons?


yes. "defense exports" to be precise.
Member
Posts: 18,358
Joined: Jan 8 2022
Gold: 22,843.67
Mar 3 2025 03:00pm
id hope we never do that. talk about a scum move, shaking down nations to force them to buy your stuff. thats yucky.

:)
Member
Posts: 9,701
Joined: Mar 2 2006
Gold: 1,590.00
Mar 4 2025 03:49am
If you are extremely shocked by how the conflict in Ukraine is culminating, then perhaps your echo chamber shields you from crucial facts and creates multiple blind zones.

Also, your favourite stars of the commentariat are not as clever, well-informed and intellectually decent as you might think.

They might be telling you what you want to hear, create a comfort zone amidst raging insanity - do anything except explaining what’s really going on in all its complexity. And you might be addicted to that info-morphine.
Member
Posts: 56,398
Joined: Jan 19 2007
Gold: 585,113.49
Mar 4 2025 03:56am
id hope we never do that. talk about a scum move, shaking down nations to force them to buy your stuff. thats yucky.



yes. "defense exports" to be precise.


xD manufacturing wars around the world is US foreign policy in a nutshell.
Member
Posts: 39,679
Joined: Nov 16 2005
Gold: 13.37
Mar 4 2025 04:23am
Guys, something interesting is happening.

The thing is, in many Ukrainian groups today, where just yesterday people were calling for rallies in support of their beloved state and their beloved president, there is now wailing and crying.

The issue is that some Western European countries have warned people who are currently renewing their cards that this renewal will be the last one.

Whatever temporary protection status they are on, this is the last time they can renew it.

What are they supposed to do next?

Either find a job and get a work visa, which means that once you stop working, it's goodbye.

Or apply for refugee status.

And those people who, just yesterday, wrapped in flags, were shouting in the streets of Europe in support of their wonderful state, are now starting to apply en masse for refugee status.

Let me explain. Refugee status is granted either due to military actions when there is no possibility to find shelter within your own state- but such a possibility exists in Ukraine, as you know, because there are western regions, and Kyiv itself.

Or, generally, refugee status is granted due to persecution by your own country, by the authorities of your own state.

You won't be able to, as they do now, go back to harvest cucumbers or get dental treatment, and then return to live off the European taxpayer.

That won't work anymore, because when you seek asylum, you are seeking protection from your own state and its authorities.

Now think again: the same people who were jumping for this state just yesterday, literally yesterday, wrapped in flags and shouting "Glory to Zelenskyy," are now applying en masse for asylum, pretending that they are being persecuted by this state and by Zelenskyy himself.

How duplicitous, and yet what heroic descendants of the Cossacks.
Member
Posts: 31,666
Joined: Dec 29 2016
Gold: 291,611.20
Warn: 10%
Mar 4 2025 04:42am
Guys, something interesting is happening.

The thing is, in many Ukrainian groups today, where just yesterday people were calling for rallies in support of their beloved state and their beloved president, there is now wailing and crying.

The issue is that some Western European countries have warned people who are currently renewing their cards that this renewal will be the last one.

Whatever temporary protection status they are on, this is the last time they can renew it.

What are they supposed to do next?

Either find a job and get a work visa, which means that once you stop working, it's goodbye.

Or apply for refugee status.

And those people who, just yesterday, wrapped in flags, were shouting in the streets of Europe in support of their wonderful state, are now starting to apply en masse for refugee status.

Let me explain. Refugee status is granted either due to military actions when there is no possibility to find shelter within your own state- but such a possibility exists in Ukraine, as you know, because there are western regions, and Kyiv itself.

Or, generally, refugee status is granted due to persecution by your own country, by the authorities of your own state.

You won't be able to, as they do now, go back to harvest cucumbers or get dental treatment, and then return to live off the European taxpayer.

That won't work anymore, because when you seek asylum, you are seeking protection from your own state and its authorities.

Now think again: the same people who were jumping for this state just yesterday, literally yesterday, wrapped in flags and shouting "Glory to Zelenskyy," are now applying en masse for asylum, pretending that they are being persecuted by this state and by Zelenskyy himself.

How duplicitous, and yet what heroic descendants of the Cossacks.


Yeah they should of not renewed it this time, and just deported all the military aged males that support Zelensky and the War, right into the AFU.
*Attractive Women should be allowed to stay only if they are either working prostitutes, or have found a beta bucks European man who either married them or had children with.

This post was edited by PapaPsych on Mar 4 2025 04:50am
Member
Posts: 4,434
Joined: Feb 18 2007
Gold: 0.00
Mar 4 2025 05:15am
USA is #1 globally at about 40% of manufacturing. Russia is 2nd at 16%. France is 3rd at 11%.

if the USA spurns European buyers they can obviously not turn to Russia, but they could easily bolster France and make the nation the new defacto producer of European arms. all in an era where Europe has largely committed to balloon defense spending. nothing about that scenario is good for the USA, in fact its decidedly bad for the USA. the clear path to our success was to convince Europe to spend more, and further to buy from us. convincing them to spend more and losing the business we already have is a nightmare scenario which will lead to an economic collapse of the entire sector in the USA. im sure many will cheer at the toppling of the military industrial complex, but arms exports are a massive part of our economy, as sad as that is. no warlord simply shifts to peaceful behavior. you make weapons and then more weapons and then some more weapons. you can make less for yourself, but you cant really make less.


If Europe decides that they want to buy from someone else, let’s say tomorrow, it’s not like the French industry can keep up with the demand. And even if they build more factories etc etc it’s not something which happens overnight.
The impact of Trump’s decision is immediate and should very much concern Ukraine and Europe.
Member
Posts: 56,398
Joined: Jan 19 2007
Gold: 585,113.49
Mar 4 2025 05:16am
wtf did i just read

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 4 2025 05:17am
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
Prev1479047914792479347945001Next
Closed New Topic New Poll