Harm does not limit itself to the physical

Then pride parades, drag queen story hours...etc can all be argued to be harmful too.

You can argue whatever you want but it has to be substantiated.

What is the harm and how did you measure it?

I am not trying to prove in what way pride parades, drag queen story hours...etc are harmful to kids. I am just trying to show you that as a society, we already don't base things purely on the basis of whether it hurts someone or not. And this is born out by the fact we don't allow public nudity and public sex.

The system is definitely imperfect, and we should look to correct that.

I believe in freedom, and so do most people in the USA. We should strive for it as a goal.

Not sure what you are trying to say. Banning public nudity and public sex makes society imperfect and it needs to be fixed?


I think freedom is good to have too, however you need to realize that "because freedom!!" shouldn't be the ultimate aim for everything. We already have laws that deliberately take away certain freedoms. For example, the freedom to rape, the freedom to kill, the freedom to assault...etc and all the way down to the freedom to drive on the left side of the road. This tells us that there are things more important to a society other than freedom.

This post was edited by JessiWan on Jun 9 2023 09:38am

Your understanding of drag is incorrect.

Rape killing assault and traffic violations have measurable harms.

Public nudity and sex also do to some extent, mainly being hygiene, which is why you can go pretty far towards being nude as long as you cover the relevant holes to prevent secretions.


The way the laws in the United States are created is that by default you have the right to do something unless it is explicit that you can't. Restricting freedoms requires a cognizable harm. For constitutionally protected rights you have to go an extra step and prove that your law is narrowly tailored to stop the harm while minimizing the amount of freedom taken.


Make sense? That's the way our laws are set up. Google cognizable harm and strict scrutiny for more information

I don't think banning public nudity has to do with hygiene. I think it's more to do with people thinking it's indecent when there is nude person walking around in public. Also, people having sex in public does not harm anybody yet it's still disallowed.

Sodomy quite literally creates and spreads disease - this is common knowledge and very measurable

Since you understand biology, you are aware that the anus & anal channel are not sterile (a penis was never meant to be inserted in there)

It is an IMMENSE public harm with an immense disease burden: https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2023.1068664/full#:~:text=In%201990%E2%80%932019%2C%20the%20global,impact%20human%20lives%20and%20health.

Not to mention the recent fiasco of monkeypox which is 100% spread from sodomy

From any logical argument of actions causing measurable harms, sodomy ranks extremely highly and by any logical measure would be outlawed.

This post was edited by El1te on Jun 9 2023 10:08am