Been saying this for weeks now.

Sadly they just don't get it

The beliefs of a brainwashed liberal. Calling NATO "purely defensive" is the best joke I've heard all week.

NATO is the modern-day equivalent of the third reich, a new army in the vein of Napoleon or Hitler which is once again meant to try to force the Russian peoples into submission. Apparently the Europeans have not learned from either Napoleon or Hitler and still believe they can subjugate Russia, whom they see as genetically and racially inferior to themselves, by force.

NATO exists as a counter to "Russian aggression." Since Russia is not actually aggressive and has no intentions to invade neither Ukraine or the Baltics or Europe at all, as it gains nothing by doing so, NATO doesn't really have a reason to exist. So in reality its existence is justified only by fearmongering and warmongering against Russia. Thus, this organization cannot accept peace and it can't tell the truth because then it would undermine its own very existence.

If they start a war with Russia, not only it will end the same as way as Napoleon or Hitler, but this time around it will be much more devastating thanks to the advent of nuclear weapons.

Honestly, the people of Europe should be demanding that NATO answer for their crimes against humanity.

The most glaringly obvious reason is Operation GLADIO, which saw NATO forces deliberately murder civilians in false flag operations all over Europe that were then blamed on the Soviet Union. This false flag operation is not a conspiracy, it has been confirmed as being a real military operation. Why did the people of Europe not demand that NATO answer for this evil, sick operation, considering that it resulted in the deaths of hundreds of their own people?

Then there is their open involvement in Ukraine. When Ukraine's military was on the offensive against Donbass in 2014-2015, Ukrainian troops received direct assistance on the ground from NATO advisors, who helped advise military maneuvers and provide combat training. They were also supplied with NATO munitions that were used to kill thousands of civilians. NATO literally helped the fascists in the Ukrainian army more effectively massacre their own nation's citizens.

The terrorists in Syria also received assistance from European nations, and by extension, NATO. Most of the terrorist's weapons were transported to them via an operation with its origins in Eastern Europe, specifically a few of the baltic states.

NATO is a disgusting organization that has been involved in countless atrocities designed to further the interests of western imperialism and quite frankly, Europe would be better off as a whole if they ceased to exist, as their ceaseless warmongering places them all in danger of an unnecessary military confrontation with Russia.

Europe should ultimately replace NATO with some kind of armed force that is actually under their own control and beholden to foreign policy that actually reflects the interests of their people, instead of being slaves to this organization which cannot even admit the truth about itself.

someone needs their meds ASAP

Sorry my bad that I actually care about the truth and that I care about whether or not nuclear war happens.

If our politicians start WW3, they will be able to do so because of the arrogance of so many people that shamelessly chose not only to believe the propaganda but also failed to realize just how devastating it would actually be for them. They would be able to do it because there was not enough push-back, and not enough outrage to stop them from pushing the big red button.

In the end you will have only yourselves to blame.

nah, putin and biden are too blame.

This entire thing is literally about nothing other than oil. Period. Saudi Arabia, who owns the United States, doesn’t like Russia and Iran selling oil and gas to Western Europe. This whole thing is a thinly veiled attempt at goading Putin into doing something so the Saudi puppet state of America can protect its oil interests.

I don't think you understand the term "liberal" if you're accusing me of that. NATO is probably the most peaceful organization (after the Vatican) on the planet and will only attack if they are attacked. If you don't attack a NATO ally, then there's zero reason to fear. NATO needs to exist because there is safety in numbers and there are a lot of weak, pathetic countries that benefit from the alliance. As I said before, Russia is welcome to join NATO if they fear a greater enemy.

I'm not sure why you're fear mongering about nuclear war in the other thread either. Even if Russia lost a quarter million soldiers, they wouldn't use nuclear weapons. We would need to be in a state of total war where civilian casualties rival that of WW2 to even consider using them. That's simply not going to happen even if the US engages the Russians in open combat (which won't happen either).

Blatant falsehood. During the Balkan wars in the 90s, there was no NATO member or ally under attack, yet NATO still decided to wage war against Serbia and bomb Belgrade - and they did it without having a UN mandate either.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia


Don't get me wrong, intervening to stop the bloodshedding was the right thing to do at the time, but it still contradicts your claim that NATO only minds its own business and poses no threat to anyone, not even to smaller powers within its own sphere of influence.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jan 30 2022 11:45am

You both have valid arguments. For Nato it is all about strength in numbers and they are not militarily aggressive per se, however at the same time trying to rope Ukraine into Nato is in effect the first step towards a Russian response re: Ukraine.