Quote (InsaneBobb @ 1 Jun 2022 11:03)
Ukraine is not a woman being raped. Ukraine is a nation that has been unkind to some of it's regions.
Crimea had a referendum. They voted to be annexed by Russia. More than once. This was an overwhelming majority vote.
The Donbas region has literally been raped by the Asov Battalion since 2014, when they declared independence from Ukraine, citing a sham election and massive corruption on unheard of scales.
Ukraine entered an agreement that they would never attempt to join NATO. Ukraine entered an agreement that Russian access to naval ports was a guaranteed. They have attempted to defy both agreements.
Ukraine has attempted to tax energy out of Russia and into Europe, Ukraine has been building up a massive military presence in the Donbas region for the last several years.
Now, as to what Ukraine HASN'T done. They haven't had some illusive ace shooting down dozens of Russian pilots. They didn't have a snake island incident where troops refused to surrender and died valiantly to the last man. They surrendered and were healthy and relatively unharmed in Russian custody, assured they'd be returned to Ukraine after the conflict. They have not acted in good faith regarding arms shipments they've received, especially from the US, with over 80% of all munitions randomly disappearing. They haven't made any great strides in staving off the Russian advance, and have not shown they're competent at much other than propaganda.
Bottom line, rather than other nations continuing to supply hundreds of billions worth of weapons, ammunition, and other military support out of their own coffers, how about Ukraine goes to the table, acknowledges that Crimea and Donbas hates them, NATO will be denied them, and simply acknowledge the reality?
The absolute worst thing anyone anyone did was raise one single opinion regarding Russia-Ukraine. It's their issue, they can deal with it. If Ukraine never expected to have help, they'd have dealt with the Russians diplomatically. Now? Well Ukraine, reap what you sow.
Soviet style referendum. If Russians were to make referendum in New York, they would decide to join Russia too, lol.
Russian raze Donbas, not Ukrainians/Azov.
Donbas is Ukraine. These people are Ukrainian. They speak Russian language, just as the Americans speak english, but speaking Russian doesnt make you Russian, just as speaking english doesnt make you English.
There was a frozen war in Donbas that Russian started in 2014, are you surprised that UA built up their defenses in Donbas?
Tell me, when did Ukraine made a deal with Russia that they wont try to enter NATO? I doubt it.
Russia made a deal with Ukraine, now they broke it in 2014, and now again with a fullscale assault. How do you expect Ukrainians to sit at the table when Russians just dont give a fuck about any deals and just do what they want, when they want?
The reality is that Russia gets their asses badly kicked in Ukraine.
They lost near the Kiyv, then they lost near Kharkiv, then they only made very small advances in Donbas. Nearly total failure of the Russian army.
Of course Im not a prophet, it looks like Russia is loosing now but it can change in the future.
This post was edited by Ironfister on Jun 1 2022 06:18am