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May 21 2022 01:26am
We Should Say It. Russia Is Fascist.

People disagree, often vehemently, over what constitutes fascism. But today’s Russia meets most of the criteria that scholars tend to apply. It has a cult around a single leader, Vladimir Putin. It has a cult of the dead, organized around World War II. It has a myth of a past golden age of imperial greatness, to be restored by a war of healing violence — the murderous war on Ukraine.

Many hesitate to see today’s Russia as fascist because Stalin’s Soviet Union defined itself as antifascist. But that usage did not help to define what fascism is — and is worse than confusing today.

In 1939, the Soviet Union joined Nazi Germany as a de facto ally, and the two powers invaded Poland together. Nazi speeches were reprinted in the Soviet press and Nazi officers admired Soviet efficiency in mass deportations. But Russians today do not speak of this fact, since memory laws make it a crime to do so. World War II is an element of Mr. Putin’s historical myth of Russian innocence and lost greatness — Russia must enjoy a monopoly on victimhood and on victory. The basic fact that Stalin enabled World War II by allying with Hitler must be unsayable and unthinkable.

Stalin’s flexibility about fascism is the key to understanding Russia today. Under Stalin, fascism was first indifferent, then it was bad, then it was fine until — when Hitler betrayed Stalin and Germany invaded the Soviet Union — it was bad again. But no one ever defined what it meant. It was a box into which anything could be put. Communists were purged as fascists in show trials. During the Cold War, the Americans and the British became the fascists. And “anti-fascism” did not prevent Stalin from targeting Jews in his last purge, nor his successors from conflating Israel with Nazi Germany.

Soviet anti-fascism, in other words, was a politics of us and them. That is no answer to fascism.

A time traveler from the 1930s would have no difficulty identifying the Putin regime as fascist. The symbol Z, the rallies, the propaganda, the war as a cleansing act of violence and the death pits around Ukrainian towns make it all very plain. The war against Ukraine is not only a return to the traditional fascist battleground, but also a return to traditional fascist language and practice. Other people are there to be colonized. Russia is innocent because of its ancient past. The existence of Ukraine is an international conspiracy. War is the answer.

Fascists calling other people “fascists” is fascism taken to its illogical extreme as a cult of unreason. It is a final point where hate speech inverts reality and propaganda is pure insistence. It is the apogee of will over thought. Calling others fascists while being a fascist is the essential Putinist practice. Jason Stanley, an American philosopher, calls it “undermining propaganda.” I have called it “schizofascism.” The Ukrainians have the most elegant formulation. They call it “ruscism.”

Had Ukraine not resisted, this would have been a dark spring for democrats around the world. If Ukraine does not win, we can expect decades of darkness.

Source and full text:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/russia-fascism-ukraine-putin.html
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May 21 2022 01:33am
Quote (Ironfister @ May 21 2022 07:10am)
There is nothing wrong or nazi in saying "glory to Ukraine", "glory to Heroes".
Americans say "God Bless America", Ukrainians say "glory to Ukraine", that's it.



I dont even know what is MSM.
Ukraine was under soviet occupation until 30years ago.
When your country is under occupation, various people try to resist, and organize in various organizations, including farleft and farright.
Now that they are free, they get rid of like 80-90% neonazism.
The azov regiment was getting better too.
Things were looking good and getting better.


MSM stands for main stream media = Western propaganda.

Just that you know, each and every country tries to rally it's citizens behind them by telling their side of the story therefor each and every country uses propaganda.

This post was edited by Djunior on May 21 2022 01:34am
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May 21 2022 01:38am
Quote (Ironfister @ 21 May 2022 10:08)
"Deutschland Uber alles" song dates 1841 year, long before nazists, and it was also an anthem of German democratic republic long before the nazi came to power in Germany.
Not a direct calque even.
Nazi, nazi everywhere? Rotfl.


"After World War II and the fall of Nazi Germany, only the third stanza has been used as the national anthem. That stanza's incipit "Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit" ("Unity and Justice and Freedom" instead of "Gott mit uns") is considered the unofficial national motto of Germany, and is inscribed on modern German Army belt buckles and the rims of some German coins."

Guess why.
Nazis are not everwhere, but you have to admit that Azov Regiment is a proven neo-nazi organisation.

This post was edited by Norlander on May 21 2022 01:40am
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May 21 2022 03:05am
Quote (Ironfister @ 21 May 2022 05:35)
Russia attacked them in 2014 and took some of their territory.
Ukrainians expected a second attack, but many didnt expect such a fullscale assault from all directions, including Belarus.


So since 8 years they were preparing for a fight. Russia will must pay the damage soon or later.

Quote (Norlander @ 21 May 2022 07:38)
"After World War II and the fall of Nazi Germany, only the third stanza has been used as the national anthem. That stanza's incipit "Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit" ("Unity and Justice and Freedom" instead of "Gott mit uns") is considered the unofficial national motto of Germany, and is inscribed on modern German Army belt buckles and the rims of some German coins."

Guess why.
Nazis are not everwhere, but you have to admit that Azov Regiment is a proven neo-nazi organisation.


You may stop for 5 minutes to circle jerk on the 2000 guys from Azov who almost no longer exists.

This post was edited by Saucisson6000 on May 21 2022 03:06am
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May 21 2022 04:05am
Quote (Saucisson6000 @ 21 May 2022 12:05)
So since 8 years they were preparing for a fight. Russia will must pay the damage soon or later.



You may stop for 5 minutes to circle jerk on the 2000 guys from Azov who almost no longer exists.


Why should I? They were used by their government as expendables. The sooner they will realize that the better. There's at least one neo-nazi batallion fighting in Donbass for DPR. Not to mention Wagner, grp if they are involved. Do I have a pity for them? Not. Should I side with any of those in this fratricidal war? Clearly not.

Zło to zło, Saucissonie. Mniejsze, większe, średnie, wszystko jedno, proporcje są umowne a granice zatarte. Nie jestem świątobliwym pustelnikiem, nie samo dobro czyniłem w życiu. Ale jeżeli mam wybierać pomiędzy jednym złem a drugim, to wolę nie wybierać wcale.
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May 21 2022 05:28am
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May 21 2022 06:01am
@HeLiCaL

Parody of this:

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May 21 2022 06:19am
https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1527958894575857664?t=f1EKHJs0-BcG95LiNZGERw&s=19

a few days ago selensky talked about a victory parade and reconquer all of ukraine, now its suddenly diplomacy ^_^
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May 21 2022 08:10am
Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ 21 May 2022 15:19)
https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1527958894575857664?t=f1EKHJs0-BcG95LiNZGERw&s=19

a few days ago selensky talked about a victory parade and reconquer all of ukraine, now its suddenly diplomacy ^_^


Stalingrad is lost. But if ask me then it's not USRR vs Nazi Germany. More like Nazi Germany vs Fascist Italy.
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May 21 2022 02:32pm
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/19/opinion/america-ukraine-war-support.html

whats this? the new york times is questioning the ukraine narrative?
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