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Dec 21 2021 06:37am
Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ Dec 21 2021 06:32am)
thats funny coming from the guy who dehumanises unvaxxed people here all the time

fucking pedophile supporter



no plan at all, tough luck if you are a fucking whale

i never opposed tough mandates for places like retirement homes as long as they are humane (for the people there) with daily tests for the workers and everyone else going in and out

i would only support a vax mandate, if we had an actually effective vaccine that truly stops the spread

we are still back at square 1 despite having like 75% of adults vaccinated, blaming unvaccinated people for the current state is just stupid and a cheap excuse

mandates and lockdowns are destroying entire countries for the sake of a few whales and people who have reached ~ their life expectancy


You are on the right track.
But covid is caused by the test and the shot.
Not by being fat.
Although, I do agree fat is severely detrimental to your health.
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Dec 21 2021 07:12am
Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ 21 Dec 2021 12:32)
thats funny coming from the guy who dehumanises unvaxxed people here all the time

fucking pedophile supporter


Hidding behind a multi like a pussy, spreading neo-nazi ideology, and bullying people.
For sure you are the superior one LOL.
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Dec 21 2021 07:32am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Dec 21 2021 06:08am)
Neither drugs nor obesity are infectious. And neither junkies nor fatties threaten to suddenly require hospital treatment all at once, overwhelming healthcare on short notice and compromising the treatment of all other patients.

Neither masks nor lockdowns reduce the number of infections that society has to go through sooner or later; they just delay the inevitable. Vaccines, by contrast, reduce the impact of infections once they eventually happen. The goal can no longer be a strategy of total elimination of covid like in China, the goal has to be for society to cope with the spread of covid waves as best as possible, preferably without any restrictions, similar to how we deal with the flu or the 4 other seasonal coronaviruses in circulation. The only way to achieve this is to reduce the collective susceptibility of our society. This can happen in three ways: via natural immunity after an infection, via vaccination, or via becoming healthier (losing weight, stopping smoking etc).

The latter is a long-term endeavor and not a solution for the short-term crisis, the former is too risky and would come with too great collateral damage among the risk groups. Hence, the vaccinations are the best solution we have. It doesn't even matter all thaaat much how many young, healthy folks are vaccinated, but among the 60+ age group, perhaps even 50+, there shouldn't be a single person who's not either vaccinated or recovered from a previous infection. Among the 50+ year olds, there is also no real debate about the risk-benefit ratio of the vaccines.


If we're looking at short-term measures, its still makes more sense by this logic to target the restrictive mandates onto the high-risk groups. Like a total vaccine mandate for the fat, sick and elderly in specific. And for flattening the curve to reduce that ICU strain, it makes sense to impose the restrictive lockdowns on everyone, not to exempt the vaccinated mask-wearing crowds, because those crowds are the ones spreading it like wildfire. Neither of these approaches are palatable. Folks in NYC want to go to the gym and wear a mask to virtue signal and feel self-righteous even if a mask no more protects you from Covid than it stops you from smelling my farts. And lord knows that even when the appetite for total lockdowns did exist during the first year of the pandemic, BLM marchers and rioters just ignored it en masse and with the support of the same politicians who championed lockdowns. But no politician anywhere is about to start antagonizing fat and/or old people as a group, even if they hypocritically demand others 'follow the science'.
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Dec 21 2021 07:56am
Quote (Goomshill @ 21 Dec 2021 14:32)
If we're looking at short-term measures, its still makes more sense by this logic to target the restrictive mandates onto the high-risk groups. Like a total vaccine mandate for the fat, sick and elderly in specific.

I would be okay with this. Even though we both know that a vaccine mandate tied to BMI would not be practicable and not hold up in court.

Quote
And for flattening the curve to reduce that ICU strain, it makes sense to impose the restrictive lockdowns on everyone, not to exempt the vaccinated mask-wearing crowds, because those crowds are the ones spreading it like wildfire.

Do you have any sources for this claim that the vaccinated, mask-wearing crowds are speading it like wildfire? All data I know of show case rates to be significantly higher among the unvaccinated. Generally speaking, it's ridiculous to paint this picture in which the selfish vaccinated are out and about, recklessly spreading the virus during their decadent and dispensable activities while the virtuous unvaccinated are meticulously keeping their social distance and avoid all unnecessary contacts or activities like the model citizens that they are. :rofl:

Still, you keep missing the key point: keeping cases low is not the only way to mitigate the burden on the healthcare system, vaccines also reduce the strain on ICUs because a higher share of vaccinations means that a lower share of the infected end up in hospital. The idea being that if the vaccination rate was high enough, we might still get waves (since the protection against infection itself is quite imperfect), but the impact on ICUs would be so low that hospitals are not overwhelmed, even if we let a seasonal covid wave rip without any NPIs in place (since protection against severe disease or hospitalisation is very high, particularly for those who got their booster). This was most definitely true for the previous vaccines against the Delta variant. It might even still be true against Omicron if we're lucky, although data on the protection against hospitalization or death for Omicron is still outstanding.



Quote
But no politician anywhere is about to start antagonizing fat and/or old people as a group, even if they hypocritically demand others 'follow the science'.

Yeah, well, no shit, in a country where a supermajority of 69% of all adults are overweight or obese, antagonizing fat people is not a smart idea. ;) :lol:
https://www.healthline.com/health/obesity-facts?c=1440929688962

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Dec 21 2021 07:57am
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Dec 21 2021 08:13am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Dec 21 2021 07:56am)
Do you have any sources for this claim that the vaccinated, mask-wearing crowds are speading it like wildfire? All data I know of show case rates to be significantly higher among the unvaccinated. Generally speaking, it's ridiculous to paint this picture in which the selfish vaccinated are out and about, recklessly spreading the virus during their decadent and dispensable activities while the virtuous unvaccinated are meticulously keeping their social distance and avoid all unnecessary contacts or activities like the model citizens that they are. :rofl:


Well, all the states that have vaccine mandates and generally high compliance with them yet have no difference in outcomes compared to states that don't, while its spreading like wildfire everywhere. NYC is the best example, look at their rates right now, despite being one of the most vaccinated states. Minnesota and North Dakota getting the same waves despite being polar opposites on masks and vaccines. Its clear enough that the vaccinated are spreading covid-19 in huge numbers, we're well past the supposed herd immunity threshold and yet in the midst of the 3rd outbreak, even bigger than the first two. Its not to say that the unvaccinated are somehow less individually responsible, its to say that there are so few unvaccinated that they can't account for the number of infections in this pandemic anymore.
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Dec 21 2021 08:22am
Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ Dec 21 2021 07:32am)
thats funny coming from the guy who dehumanises unvaxxed people here all the time

fucking pedophile supporter



no plan at all, tough luck if you are a fucking whale

i never opposed tough mandates for places like retirement homes as long as they are humane (for the people there) with daily tests for the workers and everyone else going in and out

i would only support a vax mandate, if we had an actually effective vaccine that truly stops the spread

we are still back at square 1 despite having like 75% of adults vaccinated, blaming unvaccinated people for the current state is just stupid and a cheap excuse

mandates and lockdowns are destroying entire countries for the sake of a few whales and people who have reached ~ their life expectancy


wow seems like you could use a break
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Dec 21 2021 09:21am
Quote (sirthom @ Dec 21 2021 01:37pm)
You are on the right track.
But covid is caused by the test and the shot.
Not by being fat.
Although, I do agree fat is severely detrimental to your health.


covid is directly attacking fat cells in the body, that makes it obvious why the US have so many deaths and places like japan dont

i spent 10 days in tokio and the only overweight people i have seen were foreigners

Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Dec 21 2021 02:12pm)

For sure you are the superior one


yes, i am

and if being pro freedom makes me a neo nazi in 2021 then the joke is on you buddy

Quote (Budgeting @ Dec 21 2021 03:22pm)
wow seems like you could use a break


indeed, its gets pretty frustrating, when you are surrounded by lefty covid karens, who cant get enough of big daddy government and act like your body, time and money belongs to them

Quote (Black XistenZ @ Dec 21 2021 02:56pm)
I would be okay with this. Even though we both know that a vaccine mandate tied to BMI would not be practicable and not hold up in court.


Do you have any sources for this claim that the vaccinated, mask-wearing crowds are speading it like wildfire? All data I know of show case rates to be significantly higher among the unvaccinated. Generally speaking, it's ridiculous to paint this picture in which the selfish vaccinated are out and about, recklessly spreading the virus during their decadent and dispensable activities while the virtuous unvaccinated are meticulously keeping their social distance and avoid all unnecessary contacts or activities like the model citizens that they are. :rofl:

Still, you keep missing the key point: keeping cases low is not the only way to mitigate the burden on the healthcare system, vaccines also reduce the strain on ICUs because a higher share of vaccinations means that a lower share of the infected end up in hospital. The idea being that if the vaccination rate was high enough, we might still get waves (since the protection against infection itself is quite imperfect), but the impact on ICUs would be so low that hospitals are not overwhelmed, even if we let a seasonal covid wave rip without any NPIs in place (since protection against severe disease or hospitalisation is very high, particularly for those who got their booster). This was most definitely true for the previous vaccines against the Delta variant. It might even still be true against Omicron if we're lucky, although data on the protection against hospitalization or death for Omicron is still outstanding.



is there even good data on who spreads how much in the real world?

we both know that, as recently discovered, the numbers in germany were completely fake ----> all unknown cases were put in the unvaxxed category
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Dec 21 2021 10:02am
Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ Dec 21 2021 10:21am)
covid is directly attacking fat cells in the body, that makes it obvious why the US have so many deaths and places like japan dont

i spent 10 days in tokio and the only overweight people i have seen were foreigners



yes, i am

and if being pro freedom makes me a neo nazi in 2021 then the joke is on you buddy



indeed, its gets pretty frustrating, when you are surrounded by lefty covid karens, who cant get enough of big daddy government and act like your body, time and money belongs to them



is there even good data on who spreads how much in the real world?

we both know that, as recently discovered, the numbers in germany were completely fake ----> all unknown cases were put in the unvaxxed category


bruh lol which party is trying to act all big gov and control a woman's body again?? both sides are guilty of big gov. you are just too stupid to realize it and blame it on "lefties". There are no sides when you are an extremist - which is likely what you are.
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Dec 21 2021 12:29pm
Quote (WickedDarkJuggalos @ Dec 20 2021 06:31pm)
Loser fucking internet person i meant every fucking thing I said. Idk what fucking clown world you live in where you get to say whatever you want with no consequences but I give a fuck this the internet or not be a fucking man and chest up with your fucking words if not try talking to me like we in the same room. Know for a fact your faggot ass wouldn’t take one step outta pocket then. Fucking mister lab rat punk ass bitch


i'd sit on your head and laugh kid.
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Dec 21 2021 12:32pm
Quote (Budgeting @ Dec 21 2021 05:02pm)
bruh lol which party is trying to act all big gov and control a woman's body again?? both sides are guilty of big gov. you are just too stupid to realize it and blame it on "lefties". There are no sides when you are an extremist - which is likely what you are.


chill out buddy, i am not an american, i have no dog in this fight and yes, the republican party is trash as well

its still a terrible comparison, whatever abortion laws are in place, it has never been easier to avoid becoming pregnant as a woman

however you cant avoid insane covid mandates and fundamental rights taken away, if you happen to live in the wrong place
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