Actually it's much less than Eastern Europe did to Russia. You are picky when trying to be friends with Bandera worshippers forgetting their bloody past while remembering what Soviets (this includes Soviet Socialist Republic of Ukraine) have done to your family member (may he rest in peace). Remind me what he was accused of?

Inb4 they admit that Bucha was shell bombed by ZSU.

War in Ukraine: the cold story of a Boutcha survivor:

Vitaliy Zhyvotovsky is still terrified by the atrocities he witnessed in Boutcha (Ukraine). In the city, for a week, he had to give up his house to the Russian soldiers who occupied the area. "I opened the door and saw guns pointed at me ," he said. In one room, the prisoners of the Russians were chained, beaten, tortured, mutilated.
"They cut off their fingers"

"Boys were brought to the kitchen, I heard them on the stairs, they were being beaten, they were screaming, and then I heard louder screams. The soldiers were making jokes and then I understood that they cut off their fingers ," says Vitaliy Zhyvotovsky. Scenes that traumatized him. "I close my eyes, I see these people with bags over their heads. Now my daughter has to take medicine for her heart," he says. Boutcha has become the symbol of the atrocities of war.

https://www.francetvinfo.fr/monde/europe/manifestations-en-ukraine/guerre-en-ukraine-le-recit-glacant-d-un-rescape-de-boutcha_5114515.html


=> This is a Topic related to ukraine, if you want to talk about something else that happened at different times and elsewhere, then make a new topic.

This post was edited by Saucisson6000 on May 2 2022 08:06am

Not accussed of anything. He was simply ordered to go into train heading towards Syberia.
I dont really care much about history: white people enslaving black, Germans being nazi or UA being bad to polish people because this is a history and is no longer.
The only country that didnt really change in Europe is Russia.

It doesn't work like this. It may be a fabricated case but there for sure will be an accusation. I can say none of the countries in Europe really changed. Time will show if Poland has changed. Otherwise it is perfect time to grab some land (Lviv, Rivno and Lutsk) for the country that Churchill described as Hyena of Europe.

This is one side of Churchill, but another side is that we were war allies later during ww2 and Churchill wanted to save Poland from the Russian occupation. Google: operation unthinkable

its all about context.

if you are talkng about the last 100 years then I would say England, Poland, Germany & Russia have all changed in that time. but in what aspect are you referring to change ?

England gave up its world sea power during/after WW2, I accept they appear to want to get power back on the world stage but wanting and being able to do something are 2 different things.
Germany has a deep cultural withdrawal from the world stage (militarily) after WW2 and is still trying to find its identity.
Poland, I would leave to the Polish man to outline the changes there
Russia retreated into itself since the collapse|reversal (however you want to describe it) of its satelite states and for a long time now has not been competing with the US.

In the round, 100 years is like blinking. the same things that happened 100 years ago, 500 years ago, will still happen in 100 years time noting it takes centuries for the human specifies to evolve, and it might not evolve, we are very aggressive and are prone to repeat mistakes of the past.


This post was edited by ferdia on May 2 2022 09:14am

Not only Poland

none of the below is written by me.

taken from Quora: [ Why did Churchill call Poland as "hyena of Europe"? ]

Because Polish leaders made a bad moral miscalculation back then (1938). A strategic one as well. Until Hitler and Stalin put their fangs out, countries in the neighborhood had their small squabbles. One was between Czechoslovakia and Poland. As usual, a little piece of a contested territory, some 800 km square. A bar fight equivalent. In 1920, when Poland was engaged in an existential fight against Soviet Russia (we won eventually), all Polish forces fighting the approaching Soviet Army, Czechoslovakia grabbed that piece of land. We Poles surely did not like this. It did feel like “stab in the back”. Still, it was not like Czechoslovaks drove into the rest of Poland, though they probably could have. They had a superb army, for the time and region, which just a short while ago was essentially governing whole of Siberia and the Russian Far East[1]. An interesting separate story, why they simply did not stay there to claim those Siberian/Far East (half of Eurasia) lands for Czechoslovakia. Probably too cold and no beer available, I guess.

When I was trying to put myself into Czech’s shoes, I thought that maybe they were certain that Poland would fall against Soviet Russia, so they thought grabbing some pieces they thought theirs, for themselves, was OK. I do not know. When Hitler decided to start chewing on Czechoslovakia, when British and French decided to wish him “bon appétit!” (Munich), and when the Czechoslovaks folded (they did not fight!), this was the point when Polish leaders made a moral mistake. And, more importantly, a gross strategic one.

Poland did not participate in the Munich conference. Still, it looked to the Polish leaders like it was perfectly justified to take those 800 square kilometers, given the circumstances. On the surface it seemed morally symmetrical. The mistake was - two moral wrongs do not make right. Hence Churchill's call, ugly but correct. Germany killed Czechoslovakia, Poland made away with a piece of a dead body. Churchill did indeed have a gift for language. The whole thing was a sad lost opportunity for both Poland and Czechoslovakia. Together, we could have forced Hitler to fight much earlier, him much worse prepared, or get him to back off altogether. Or to get his military to shot him, which they were itching to.

This story is a very good lesson for today, this is why I do not put the whole “Polish side of the story” here, there were much larger issues on the table than some schoolyard insults to settle. I repeat, that lesson is important today. And that Soviet offer to “defend Czechoslovakia”, which Poland torpedoed by refusing passage to Soviet troops? Ask the Baltic States citizens, how nice it was to have Soviet troops, 1939/40, “protect them against Germany”. They (Baltic people) liked that so much that they voted, 103%, to join the Soviet Union.

This post was edited by ferdia on May 2 2022 09:35am

I am not even sure that Moscow belongs to Russia.
/e or maybe it is, but everything around it isnt.

This post was edited by Saucisson6000 on May 2 2022 09:34am