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Apr 26 2022 11:58am
Quote (thundercock @ Apr 26 2022 12:46pm)
I agree with the British analysis here. Russia has been hitting targets in Western Ukraine, killing foreign militants in Ukraine, etc. Those are legitimate targets because they are part of the active conflict. From Ukraine's side, I think targets within Russia are equally legitimate (Rostov, Kursk, etc.) because they are directly involved in the conflict with Ukraine. Attacking those targets isn't an escalation. If Ukraine somehow fired a missile that hit Moscow, Kaliningrad, etc. then that would be an escalation IMO. Russia won't attack another country because that would bring additional members into the war. The same principal applies to Ukraine re: Belarus.

I think I agree with the

Nah, this is just bluster from Russia. They aren't irrational, Muslim terrorists....they are rational state actors. Russia is going to do everything in it's power to keep this between Ukraine and only Ukraine.


We're the ones giving them the arms to attack targets inside Russia, something Ukraine isn't capable of doing on their own.
Right now we're engaged in a proxy war in Yemen. We're supplying the weapons to the Saudis and Hadis to kill the Houthis. Our allied air force attacks targets inside Yemen held by Houthis. From the Houthis side, wouldn't targets inside the USA, or even more directly our Navy in the mideast, be considered equally legitimate? The Houthis have previously tried to attack the US navy, but have sad missiles that can't even reach them, as happened on two attempted launches. Now just to give one hypothetical, lets say that Russia supplied the Houthis with a state of the art hypersonic missile system. And they turned around and used it to sink the USS Mount Whitney flagship of the 6th fleet, with 300+ Americans killed. Is that 'legitimate'? It would be a proportional tit-for-tat response by Russia to American and EU arms striking Russian forces, would it not?

but let me go back to;

Quote
Russia won't attack another country because that would bring additional members into the war.


Assuming its all bluster has been a terrible strategy so far, hasn't it?
Russia has shown a willingness to use force in retaliation to western aggression. Do you think Vladimir Putin, who has spent his whole career engaging in tit-for-tat escalations, who has already been willing to invade another country, would take assaults on mainland Russia sitting down?
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Apr 26 2022 11:59am
Quote (Hamsterbaby @ Apr 26 2022 09:58am)
Put it this way.
If an American would tell me the below , I would truly respect him. And if he / she is ever that honest because it will be the truth.

1. America have been the dominant number 1 military and economical power since after World War 2.
-Yes, we will turn sand into glass and the sea into mist. We will blow up stuff.

2. Our liberal economical polices have put us in a dire situation.
-Yes, California has spent over $1,000,000,000 on homeless in CA, it has doubled. Liberal cities tend to have a few high paying jobs, and massive crime, rape, and murder rates with low education graduation rate. They can't read because they spend 16 hours a day being extra LGBT to get views on TikTok and Twitter. It's really pathetic. Most are unemployed living with parents or work as writers for propaganda. Very few life skills. Cali's education is catching up to Mississippi as the worst education in America. Liberal policies stopped facts, started feelings.

3. We are the number 1 fossil fuel consuming nation in the world, we need to make sure our supply line and crude / gas supply is safe from the middle east.
-We should take the middle east entirely over. Cavemen don't deserve a trillion a year when they throw gays off rooftops and burn women alive for, name a reason (I've seen more than 1 video of this, sucks, its etched into my brain watching men throw large stones and kill a woman then set her on fire, hard to watch, harder to forget). Fuck em, replace em, move on. We need oil, we need gas, for the next 100 years at least. Our entire infrastructure beyond pooping in the woods requires resources. Either we have them or we don't. Concepts are useless, invent something or shut up to most of these folk.

4. Nope we are not about to use too much of our own oil and gas because those are wartime reserves.
-Could be. I've been curious and sometimes optimistic that our powerful leaders are actually playing the long game, allowing the rest of the world to deplete itself. Although, oil isn't just dinobones its naturally occurring as well. There is more than you think in the crust and mantle of our spacerock.

5.We need to continue to dominate on a couple of industry namely, oil and gas, weapons , pharmaceutical and last but not least technology and mass media.
-Our single country is roughly equivalent to all of Europe. Amazing how quick individual countries talk smack. Your GDP is that of Alabama, your population is homogenous and 1/25th of ours as a whole. People forget this. Europe can't even speak a single language and is rife with sex trafficking and crime in the "other countries" ya you know which ones, there's more than a few in Europe.

6. All these industries above hire millions and millions of people in the states, if anything happen to them we may have a serious situation within the country.
-Industries should only succeed when successful. Failure needs to happen more on an individual level. Once a program is enacted, its nearly impossible to ever remove it. A lot of people have nothing jobs paid for by citizens taxes and fake promises of politicians. They file paperwork that doesn't matter, and have no drive to do anything but collect a check and go home. Life is different when you're not in a business that requires success and can be endlessly pumped with stolen money by voting for certain people.

7. As long as the our population is happy, the senators and congress keep getting elected to their position and maintain their influence and power in politics and our major industries see growth and their board and share holder is happy. America is safe.
-Happiness is irrelevant past 1980. Marketing. Marketing. Marketing. Repeat a lie enough it becomes less of a lie and harder to disprove as more gullible folks repeat it, thinking its validation. Most growth is through no-bid contracts government officials and city councilman give to the big business that finance their campaigns. A few years ago in California a schoolboard member was bankrolled by a large construction company and would provide no-bid contracts to them for hundreds of millions of dollars. Councilman gets $30k, a car, and a vacation, big business gets limitless funding from the government, which only gets money by taking from workers (this is necessary conceptually, its being abused suuuuuper hard). When a conservative politician's wife JUST SO HAPPENS to own a pre-employment drug screening company, and just so happens to write legislation goading companies to get fake benefits from fake science, and it all goes back to the politician. 10% of Americans smoke weed, roughly. The FBI can't get talent because their own tests. More companies seeing it too. I turned down a job offer of $63k/year because they are still in the stone age. They even offered ways to try to overcome a drug test. They wanted to hire me, I wanted to work. Incestual programs destroy the working class.

8. Last but not least , We have no friends, we have interests, the survival of our community and our population takes first priority. The rest of the world is not our problem, unless we have interest in them.
-I don't see much AID flowing in from other countries when we have problems. Sometimes ya, mostly no. The world sees my country as a piggy bank to smash. Half the world shits in the woods and lives in huts. Every year, billions are siphoned from criminal enterprises in poor shithole countries that rob the elderly and gullible in America. Places where electricity is a maybe and women having rights is a punchline. They get lefts too. :banana:


I would so respect that person for this.

-A self sufficient, college grad in computer science, hard working, overtime loving, don't mess with me I won't mess with you American. Problem is, a large population of the world, yes world, is realizing they can cry until they get resources. Money, food, land, whatever. The world would be better off at least losing half the population. The world is too slow. Some parts are doing great and that's great. The rest, needs a culling. Looking at you big G, send another flood.

Bolded for easy reading.

This post was edited by justhackitup on Apr 26 2022 12:03pm
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Apr 26 2022 12:02pm
Quote (Hamsterbaby @ 26 Apr 2022 19:57)
(..)

For you to come up with the above quote makes me think, maybe you are not well informed of what the world is facing.

Let's side track a little bit. I am sure you heard of the "concentration and re education camps " towards the Muslims in China Xinjiang.
The Americans and some in the West have been harping on it for ages.

But do you know why most or 90 plus percent of Muslim countries didn't make any official statement on it ?


Dont know, maybe they dont really care about muslims in China?
Busy trying to destroy Israel maybe? :)
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Apr 26 2022 12:06pm
Russia to suspend gas supplies to Poland as they've refused to pay in roubles. Looks like they're making an example of Poland, I don't think they can afford to cut the gas supply from other big importers, but let's see

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61237519
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Apr 26 2022 12:10pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Apr 26 2022 10:58am)
We're the ones giving them the arms to attack targets inside Russia, something Ukraine isn't capable of doing on their own.
Right now we're engaged in a proxy war in Yemen. We're supplying the weapons to the Saudis and Hadis to kill the Houthis. Our allied air force attacks targets inside Yemen held by Houthis. From the Houthis side, wouldn't targets inside the USA, or even more directly our Navy in the mideast, be considered equally legitimate? The Houthis have previously tried to attack the US navy, but have sad missiles that can't even reach them, as happened on two attempted launches. Now just to give one hypothetical, lets say that Russia supplied the Houthis with a state of the art hypersonic missile system. And they turned around and used it to sink the USS Mount Whitney flagship of the 6th fleet, with 300+ Americans killed. Is that 'legitimate'? It would be a proportional tit-for-tat response by Russia to American and EU arms striking Russian forces, would it not?

but let me go back to;



Assuming its all bluster has been a terrible strategy so far, hasn't it?
Russia has shown a willingness to use force in retaliation to western aggression. Do you think Vladimir Putin, who has spent his whole career engaging in tit-for-tat escalations, who has already been willing to invade another country, would take assaults on mainland Russia sitting down?


No, targets inside the US would not be "legitimate" because we don't have troops in Yemen and we aren't in an active state of war. If Russia gave the Houthis state of the art technology and it was used to attack one of our ships, we would NOT go to war with Russia. We would go to war with the Houthis though!

No, I don't expect Putin to take assaults "sitting down." Every time Ukraine hits supply targets within Russia, I would expect Russia to hit corresponding targets in Ukraine. As for the bluster, Russia has been all over the place with its threats. They haven't followed through on most of them and we shouldn't expect them to.
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Apr 26 2022 12:12pm
Quote (thundercock @ Apr 26 2022 02:10pm)
No, targets inside the US would not be "legitimate" because we don't have troops in Yemen and we aren't in an active state of war. If Russia gave the Houthis state of the art technology and it was used to attack one of our ships, we would NOT go to war with Russia. We would go to war with the Houthis though!

No, I don't expect Putin to take assaults "sitting down." Every time Ukraine hits supply targets within Russia, I would expect Russia to hit corresponding targets in Ukraine. As for the bluster, Russia has been all over the place with its threats. They haven't followed through on most of them and we shouldn't expect them to.



Which threats haven’t they followed up on btw?
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Apr 26 2022 12:14pm
This post is a violation of the site rules and appropriate action was taken.

I love the moral grandstanding against Russia, its rich coming from Americans.

"We're morally superior to them, just ignore the thousands of middle easterners we've killed and ruined the lives of in the last 20 years, for no reason whatsoever."

Russia is literally being aggressed upon by Nato (US) on their doorstep and they actually follow through on their red line and do something about it, so Putin's literally Hitler.....

Give me a break, you cum guzzling, state dept propaganda guzzling morons.

Support for Ukraine is just the latest psy-op virtue-signaling campaign you lemmings fell for. Can't wait to see which one comes next.

This post was edited by Payn3 on Apr 26 2022 12:17pm
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Apr 26 2022 12:15pm
Quote (dro94 @ Apr 26 2022 01:06pm)
Russia to suspend gas supplies to Poland as they've refused to pay in roubles. Looks like they're making an example of Poland, I don't think they can afford to cut the gas supply from other big importers, but let's see

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61237519


Its going to be chilly for the next few weeks in Krakow. Won't drop into freezing
Poland made a big show out of saying they would stop importing Russian gas next winter, circa december. Posturing, as they still don't have anything to replace it lined up, one LNG terminal does not supply a whole country. Half its gas and more than half its oil, what's the plan, beg the EU to reverse the direction of the pipelines?
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Apr 26 2022 12:20pm
Quote (ofthevoid @ Apr 26 2022 11:12am)
Which threats haven’t they followed up on btw?


I do not have a comprehensive list of all the threats and follow throughs that Russia has made during the past year. Having said that, here is what I have off the top of my head: all of their nuclear threats, their threats against Finland/Sweden, military retaliation against the West, etc.

I suppose you could argue that they would follow through with placing nuclear weapons and hypersonic missiles in Kaliningrad but that doesn't really change anything, does it?
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Apr 26 2022 12:27pm
Quote (Ironfister @ Apr 26 2022 05:37pm)
According to the common war rules, providing a country with weapons is not considered as an act of joining the war. Ukraine is Independent country and we can continue trading with them. Of course Russia can attack NATO anytime they want, just as they did with Ukraine. They might ask something like "give us Alaska or we will attack you" or "stop all trading with Ukraine or we will attack you", but honestly we shouldnt just give up to Russian villain demands like this. Are you American? Are you ready to give Alaska for peace? And how do you know Russia stops at Alaska and dont Ask for anything more in the future?


As I previously mentioned to you, as you are late to this topic, there is no harm to read back over the topic in order to get a better understanding of the topic content (from a different viewpoint). I would again recommend going over the topic, in particular the first 100 posts, and any video's referenced there. If thats not in the art of the possible then, You will note on post #1 that I outlined what was about to happen. You will note on post #14 i declared my nationality and you will note on post #74 a video was provided by another user which i whole heartedly agreed with.

If you read the topic in totality or even just watched that one video, you will know why Russia will not invade Poland and you will know why Ukraine was Russia's red line. Also if you read the recent posts you would also know why Russia will not invade Finland and Sweden who are imminently due to join NATO /e unless Croatia throw a spanner in the works.

I dont know the common war rules you are referring to. The Red Cross references the international humanitarian law, https://www.icrc.org/en/document/10-things-rules-of-war-geneva-conventions however the concept of war by proxy should not be an alien term. if you are unfamiliar, use google/wiki.

Ultimately you are free to voice your own opinions however what I would say is: sending peace keepers into Ukraine was an insanely poor idea, as was suggesting sending fighter jets into Ukraine via USA. While this may have been suggested with the best of intentions, this could also lead to escalation of war outside of the boarders of Ukraine and Russia. I am now reading that Germany is sending tanks directly to Ukraine. While you might be jumping for joy the rest of the world is holding its breath to see what reaction Russia will make as more and more shipments of this nature take place.

Quote (thundercock @ Apr 26 2022 07:20pm)
I do not have a comprehensive list of all the threats and follow throughs that Russia has made during the past year. Having said that, here is what I have off the top of my head: all of their nuclear threats, their threats against Finland/Sweden, military retaliation against the West, etc. I suppose you could argue that they would follow through with placing nuclear weapons and hypersonic missiles in Kaliningrad but that doesn't really change anything, does it?


it does not change anything. they (Russia) would be annoyed at Finland and they WILL do something, on top of weaponising the board per se, but no armed conflict. Russia has basically already said this.

This post was edited by ferdia on Apr 26 2022 12:30pm
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