Just to point it out: you're uncriticially embracing the Russian framing of this conflict: "Western support for Ukraine = risking WW3" and "creating realities on the ground with naked violence which leave Ukraine no other choice than to surrender = peace".



The context is important. The full quote is:
“This is exactly what Putin has been wanting for a long time: it is extremely important for him to weaken his isolation, Russia’s isolation, and to have normal negotiations that will not end in anything,” Zelensky said about Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s call.

So what Zelensky is implying is that Putin has for a long time sought an opportunity to fake a willigness to negotiate in good faith (out of PR reasons), but that his negotiations will not yield any diplomatic results because Putin isn't actually interested. (And why would he, considering that his fortunes on the battlefield improve from week to week?)

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Nov 16 2024 01:31am

It's capitulation. Russia has always had an open phone line to make a deal. Western EU states such as Germany have maintained a childlike "we won't talk to you" attitude. Now that they're losing on the battlefield and Trump is going to cut funding, Germany wants to make a deal. Shouldn't Germany keep funding them 'for as long as it takes'?

uncritically? where have you been this is post count #45573. i posted multiple time critical of putin. but lets look at this plainly : russia has repeatedly sought a diplomatic solution to this war and the west, under instructions from the US, has instead ever sought to escalate the war. the facts speak for themselves.

This post was edited by ferdia on Nov 16 2024 03:29am

There's some pretty key breakdowns happening across the front which is a telling sign of Ukraine's depleted troop levels. Many troops were redirected from quiet parts of fronts to either deploy to Kursk or reinforce south Donetsk that has been collapsing. So now you're starting to see unexpected cracks in areas that were static for many months.

Russia had a quick advance capturing the eastern part of Chasiv Yar.

https://x.com/JulianRoepcke/status/1857774650228420969

Unexpected breakthrough in Kupyansk in the north

https://x.com/AMK_Mapping_/status/1857651900965105666

The way I would frame it is, Zelensky was a war time leader, an inspiring and charismatic presence, the figure head of the Ukrainian Government, of resistance, against a dreadful invader. He was responsible for the Nation of Ukraine. However, this is where there is a problem. Being responsible for Ukraine, from the point at which he outlawed any negotiation with Russia (and the US also closed down any backdoor channels lets not forget) he will not be well regarded by historians. Always leave a door open for dialogue, and always seek whats best for your people. Prolonging the war against Russia may be in US interests (I dont agree) but prolonging the war from a Ukrainian perspective is not in their interests.

While it remains to be seen if Donald Trump will be president of the United States, his team will seek a negotiated settlement, this is a scenario from which Zelensky as leader of Ukraine will not survive. The most plausible scenario is that there will be regime change in Ukraine in summer 2025.

Some links: https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20241116-zelensky-says-wants-to-end-war-by-diplomacy-next-year Zelensky says he wants Russia-Ukraine war to end by ‘diplomatic means’ in 2025
Al Jazeera: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/11/16/g7-backs-ukraine-as-zelenskyy-says-he-wants-to-end-war-next-year

So it looks like the hard conversation between Trump and Zelensky has occured.

TLDR : When Trump says he will do something, he is going to do it. (all the lefties were bitching that he cant realistically end the Ukraine war anytime soon, well here we are).

This post was edited by ferdia on Nov 16 2024 01:01pm

they can leave Ukraine today, and that solves entire conflict

don't spew kremlin propaganda that Ukraine doesn't want to surrender and that means they want war

Don't spew NATO propaganda and move East and that solve the entire conflict.

Except that Scholz hasn't called Putin to make a deal, he called to ask Putin to withdraw his troops from Ukraine. Completely delusional and will of course go nowhere. This call didn't amount to anything substantial. It was a very marginal PR win for Putin because one Western country broke its silence. But Kyiv is vastly overstating the degree to which this phone call is indicative of the Western ostracization of Russia crumbling.

In reality, this was a symbolic gesture by Scholz primarily aimed at a domestic audience. His government just collapsed last week, his Social Democrats (SPD) will face a very tough snap election in February, his own party has a strong appeasenik faction and the SPD is under pressure from Russia-friendly upstart parties on the left and the right. A significant portion of the German electorate want a diplomatic solution to the Ukraine war, so he threw them a bone. The fact that he was unwavering in his unrealistic position ("a fair peace is only possible if Russia withdraws all its troops") proves that it was indeed a symbolic move and nothing more. Truth be told, Scholz is an insanely stubborn and hardheaded guy; he basically never changes his opinion on anything.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Nov 16 2024 04:51pm

Whats your view then on Donald Trumps quest for peace?