Because they didn't want to be tortured & slaughtered by Ukronazis who control the areas. This is just propaganda, you didn't hear them because their voices were silenced, all dissenting media in Ukraine is outlawed under pain of torture by Ukronazis, Ukraine is an autocratic totalitarian state

Ukraine snatches & press gangs young boys and older men off the streets to go be sent to fight a war they don't want

This post was edited by El1te on Oct 28 2024 11:20am

That’s literally what happened in 2014. Riots in Odessa, Kharkiv and other cities. Crushed by neonazis, civilians burned to death. Aidan and Kraken are now stationed in Kharkiv to suppress popular revolt. They are notorious for kidnapping, mutilating and torturing people. Human rights reports about their escapades before the invasion were posted here many times.You would be suicidal to try to do something in eg Kharkiv now in 2020s without having solid numbers and weapons to support your uprising. Civilian will get slaughtered if they try to oppose Kraken.

Having said that - the map is still correct. You can find another one showing ethnic and cultural divide dated 2014 or 2020. You are also invited to see many videos out of eg Odessa right now in 2024, where people openly show no support to the central powers in Kiev, speaking Russian in interviews to openly hostile Western Ukranian journalists.

Or you can talk to Ukranians you know out of Kharkov and Odessa what they think and whether they have any warm and fuzzy feelings towards Bandera followers who murdered Jews (predominant Odessa citizens even to this date) for the fun of it. Remember - Odessa citizens are two strikes off on the chart of neonazis hate. They are Jewish and Russian. Oy vey.

Remember that lady that got detained for hoisting a Russian flag in Odessa few weeks back? What happened to her?

This post was edited by Malopox on Oct 28 2024 12:07pm

So autocratic and totalitarian that it allowed some 10m of its people to leave the country when this war began.
Also, we're talking about February/March 2022 here, a time when Russian troops were on the doorstep of Kharkiv, Mykolaiv, etc. Are we really supposed to believe that Ukrainian ultranationalists in this situation were preoccupied with terrorizing their own civilian population rather than go fight the Russian enemy which was shelling their cities?


Afaik, the press gangs only became prevalent at a later point, when recruiters ran out of volunteers (of which there were many in the early days).





Does speaking Russian automatically imply a pro-Russian stance in this war?

I just have to go back to my earlier question: are we really to believe that several years of shelling of their cities by the Russian has had no effect on the residents of front-line cities like Kharkiv? Is it plausible that this experience has endeared the Russians to any of them? Is it plausible that there weren't many who were driven away from the Russian side by it?

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Oct 28 2024 01:46pm

Ukraine has long since passed their Enabling Act - there is no freedom of press, speech or organization, opposition parties are banned, there are no elections. It's literally a totalitarian state in the present. They let a bunch of pro-Ukronazi grandmas and expats/visitors leave, big whoop. Being a man in Ukraine? Lol enjoy your freedom!

"Their own civilian population" that they consider enemies of the state and Russian actors? Yes, of course they did? They view pro-Russian Ukraine citizens as enemies of the state to be tortured, and they have since the coup in 2014, not 2022. Russia's 2022 intervention in Ukraine is a liberation campaign for the tortured and oppressed Russian minority - similar to how we intervened in your country back in 1945 to liberate the Jews and other oppressed minority groups from a different totalitarian state.

Is press ganging a tactic that is compatible with a free democracy? If they ran out of volunteers, that means Ukrainians want the war to end, and they don't want to fight. A democracy would respect that. Impressment has been abolished in the Anglosphere for over 200 years - aligning with the abolishment of slavery, because impressment is literally slave catching.

The whole denial of Ukronazis and their crimes against humanity is mind boggling. These people are very open about it.

This post was edited by El1te on Oct 28 2024 02:21pm

The Ukrainian military just preoccupied itself with hunting down and killing a group of civilians fleeing to the east as Russia was on the doorstep... yesterday
There's some drone footage showing a group leaving Chasiv Yar with white flags and carts walking on foot towards Russian lines, and UA forces called in artillery and drones to bomb them numerous times. One guy on crutches hid in a bombed out shack and a UA drone pilot flew a suicide drone into it to blow him up. It was a lengthy hunt and kill operation where they were clearly visible as surrendering civilians and the Ukrainians just kept trying to kill them until they were all dead.

This just in: Neo-nazis don't need an excuse to terrorize a civilian population. Killing innocent people is just another sunday



I have to stress this point: there are so many videos of Ukrainians Nazis committing war crimes that whenever we bring it up in this thread, which is quite often, I just point to whatever video is from the last few days. Throw a stick in the air and it will land on proof of war crimes

This post was edited by Goomshill on Oct 28 2024 02:58pm

I suppose I should mention the comparison I'm looking at for mediated partitions is Germany annexing various chunks of land leading up to WW2. Up until Bohemia/Poland, everything was majority German-speaking of German ethnics living outside the country of Germany, but I have to wonder if those people preferred not to live in the country of Germany. So therefore, it seems as though international recognition is an easier sell if it is largely along language/nationality lines.

Foreign fighters killed in new Ukrainian incursion attempt – FSB
.....as well as personal items indicating that they belonged to “third countries,” such as a Canadian flag, a Polish prayer book, and a notepad with notes on tactics in English.

Additionally, one of the would-be invaders also reportedly had tattoos of the 75th Ranger Regiment
https://www.rt.com/russia/606627-ukraine-mercenaries-russia-incursion/

Saw the pic of the supposed "Canadian"

No, speaking Russian doesn’t automatically imply a pro-Russian stance. There are plenty of Russian speakers and Russians that do not support this war, including those that are staying in Russia.

The map I posted is that of political divide in 2004. It is still there and people generally have doubt where Western Ukranian leadership is leading them. More and more are openly critical as they see people being kidnapped off the streets and neonazi leadership boasting about their cure little war crimes in their cute little telegram blogs.

Russia is not making any friends by bombing people to death - that much is true, however in stark contrast to actions of western countries claiming moral outrage, civilian toll is way less than any comparable NATO intervention or Israel conflict.

Russia seems to be genuinely rebuilding towns they destroyed (eg Mariupol) and investing heavily in infrastructure (rail links etc) to ensure people have jobs and can lead a normal life. Newly integrated regions will cost billions to Russian taxpayers in reconstruction alone.

What really tilts people to Russian side is the double dealing of western allies where Ukranians are treated as 2nd tier people when it comes to their war effort as Israel clearly comes first. Many people that left to Europe are disillusioned and choose to return home.

When the war started we accepted a Ukranian girl from Mariupol as a refugee - she was helping us out with kids. She chose to return back to Ukraine to be with her family and fiancée. We still have a chat once in a while with her to check in how she’s doing.

This post was edited by Malopox on Oct 29 2024 02:14am

Petulant behavior by the Ukrainian delegation at South Africa, the FM traveled there on a 2 day trip. During the meeting with his SA counterpart his delegation demanded the RT News microphone be removed. SA did not comply. So the UA guys walked up and covered it with a propaganda book titled "Crimea Is Ours". Which the SA attendees then took right back down

whole bunch of serious people in suits and the country ostensibly led by a dwarf in permanent sweat pants is monkeying around.

In one part not made public, Mr. Zelensky proposed a “nonnuclear deterrence package” in which Ukraine would get Tomahawk missiles, a totally unfeasible request, a senior U.S. official said. A Tomahawk has a range of 1,500 miles, more than seven times the range of the long-range missile systems called ATACMS
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/29/world/europe/ukraine-zelensky-russia-war.html

No New Limits on Ukraine's Use of US Weapons if N.Korea Enters Fight, Pentagon Says
https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2024-10-28/no-new-limits-on-ukraines-use-of-us-weapons-if-n-korea-enters-fight-pentagon-says

All part of the plan