d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate > Russia / Ukraine
Prev1439743984399440044014465Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
Member
Posts: 19,599
Joined: Apr 13 2016
Gold: 32,517.50
Jul 18 2024 06:48am
Quote (Malopox @ Jul 18 2024 01:20pm)
Ran out of shit to sling so soon and started dodging? Take some rest and come again with some fresh ideas.


You are one of the above mentioned pro Russian shills.
See my post for an explanation of your logical fallacies and moral ineptitude.

In fact, revert to that post anytime you want to project that beyond the pale levels of hypocrisy.

Deriding Zelensky as a nazi while apologising for Putins literal Nazi playbook invasion of Ukraine is batshit crazy levels of morally devoid hypocrisy.

Stop having your cake and eating it mr pot.
Member
Posts: 8,508
Joined: Mar 2 2006
Gold: 3,971.00
Jul 18 2024 07:06am
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ 18 Jul 2024 14:48)
You are one of the above mentioned pro Russian shills.
See my post for an explanation of your logical fallacies and moral ineptitude.


You provided no explanations or arguments and claim moral superiority while continuing to literally sling shit. Rich.

Quote (Prox1m1ty @ 18 Jul 2024 14:48)
In fact, revert to that post anytime you want to project that beyond the pale levels of hypocrisy.

Deriding Zelensky as a nazi while apologising for Putins literal Nazi playbook invasion of Ukraine is batshit crazy levels of morally devoid hypocrisy.

Stop having your cake and eating it mr pot.


You must have me confused with somebody. Take some rest. You seem tired and out of your shallow depth again.

This post was edited by Malopox on Jul 18 2024 07:07am
Member
Posts: 19,599
Joined: Apr 13 2016
Gold: 32,517.50
Jul 18 2024 09:35am
Quote (Malopox @ Jul 18 2024 02:06pm)
You provided no explanations or arguments and claim moral superiority while continuing to literally sling shit. Rich.



You must have me confused with somebody. Take some rest. You seem tired and out of your shallow depth again.


Denial. Unsurprisingly

No i dont have confused with anyone, although the same anti Ukrainian rhetoric spouting does make you essentially indistinguishable from the shill pack.

You know exactly the hypocrisy of calling Ukrainians Nazis. They are no more Nazis than parts of the Russian military and even Russian society including scores of Ultra nationalist groups.

It just suits your narrative to ignore the blatant hypocrisy. I get it.
Self reflection is not a traditionally strong Russian virtue.

Maybe when your done visiting kindergartens you can do some more study on Russian neo-nazi groups.
It should go a bit like the classic Mitchel and Webb sketch.

Member
Posts: 8,508
Joined: Mar 2 2006
Gold: 3,971.00
Jul 18 2024 09:50am
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ 18 Jul 2024 17:35)
Denial. Unsurprisingly

No i dont have confused with anyone, although the same anti Ukrainian rhetoric spouting does make you essentially indistinguishable from the shill pack.

You know exactly the hypocrisy of calling Ukrainians Nazis. They are no more Nazis than parts of the Russian military and even Russian society including scores of Ultra nationalist groups.

It just suits your narrative to ignore the blatant hypocrisy. I get it.
Self reflection is not a traditionally strong Russian virtue.

Maybe when your done visiting kindergartens you can do some more study on Russian neo-nazi groups.
It should go a bit like the classic Mitchel and Webb sketch.

https://i.ibb.co/tCBDJHG/50dfb794-8414-4f41-8e90-37087d12aaaf-1600x900.jpg


Ah so in a fit of rage, frothing at your mouth with righteous racist hatred for everything you dislike or don’t understand - you did confuse me with someone.

You are attributing your own imagination purporting those fevered dreams as my own words, which I find cute to say the least. I understand that I live rent free in your head for a long time now and you can’t stop yourself from commenting or thinking about me and imagining things I’ve done and said. I hate to break it to you, most of them were born and will stay in your imagination only, which is a sign of a possible ongoing psychosis.

As mentioned above, you are one of the few warmongers left here that wants to propagate pain, suffering and loss of life everywhere around the world under the guise of your misguided “morals”. You regularly repost pictures of dead or dying soldiers while neither me nor anybody else here posts such disgusting and vile celebration of human suffering. Sad part is that you are so blinded by your hatred and rage - you are unable to distinguish a Ukranian from a Russian, yet you come here to expose your arrogance and ignorance again and again, having oh so little understand of the complexity of this conflict.

Do better. Do good.

This post was edited by Malopox on Jul 18 2024 10:02am
Member
Posts: 14,670
Joined: Jun 27 2010
Gold: 100,701.50
Jul 18 2024 10:52am
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Jul 18 2024 05:35pm)
Denial. Unsurprisingly

No i dont have confused with anyone, although the same anti Ukrainian rhetoric spouting does make you essentially indistinguishable from the shill pack.

You know exactly the hypocrisy of calling Ukrainians Nazis. They are no more Nazis than parts of the Russian military and even Russian society including scores of Ultra nationalist groups.

It just suits your narrative to ignore the blatant hypocrisy. I get it.
Self reflection is not a traditionally strong Russian virtue.

Maybe when your done visiting kindergartens you can do some more study on Russian neo-nazi groups.
It should go a bit like the classic Mitchel and Webb sketch.

https://i.ibb.co/tCBDJHG/50dfb794-8414-4f41-8e90-37087d12aaaf-1600x900.jpg


Bolded

You're a scathing hypocrite comrade

Let me remind you real quick that Ukrainian nazi SS war criminals were taken in by the UK and Canada and memorials were built on UK and Canadian soil.

That's the kind of guys that are now called Banderites they're literally Nazi sympathizers. In the vid Mark Felton also explain the Russians were our allies in WW2.

Inb4 another rage essay

Member
Posts: 8,508
Joined: Mar 2 2006
Gold: 3,971.00
Jul 18 2024 11:25am
Viktor Orban has released his statement to Charles Michel - President of the European Council. I think it’s worth posting in full:
https://miniszterelnok.hu/en/report-of-prime-minister-viktor-orban-to-charles-michel-president-of-the-european-council/

Dear President,

Please find below a summary evaluation of my recent discussions with leaders of Ukraine, Russia, China, Türkiye and President Donald J. Trump, as well as a few suggestions for your consideration.

1. It is a general observation that the intensity of the military conflict will radically escalate in the near future.

2. I personally witnessed that the warring parties are determined to involve themselves deeper into the conflict, and neither of them would like to make initiatives for a ceasefire or peace negotiations. Therefore we can assume that tensions will not decrease and the parties will not start searching for a way out of the conflict without significant external involvement.

3. There are three global players that are able to influence developments: the European Union, the United States and China. We also have to take into consideration as an important regional player Türkiye as the only successful mediator between Ukraine and Russia since the outbreak of the hostilities in 2022.

4. China will continue its policy also formulated in international documents calling for a ceasefire and peace talks. However, China will play a more active role only if the chance for success of its engagement is close to certain. In their evaluation this is not the case at the moment.

5. With regards to the United States, I experienced at the NATO Summit and during my talks with President Trump that the US is at the moment heavily preoccupied with the presidential campaign. The incumbent President is making immense efforts to stay in the race. It is obvious that he is not capable of modifying the current US pro-war policy and therefore cannot be expected to start a new policy. As we have witnessed many times over the past years, in these situations bureaucracy without political leadership will continue to go down the previous path.

6. During my talks with President Trump, I came to a conclusion that foreign policy will play only a small role in his campaign, which is dominated by internal political questions. Therefore we can expect no peace initiative coming from him until the elections. I can however surely state that shortly after his election victory, he will not wait until his inauguration, but will be ready to act as a peace broker immediately. He has detailed and well-founded plans for this.

7. I am more than convinced that in the likely outcome of the victory of President Trump, the proportion of the financial burden between the US and the EU will significantly change to the EU’s disadvantage when it comes to the financial support of Ukraine.

8. Our European strategy in the name of transatlantic unity has copied the pro-war policy of the US. We have not had a sovereign and independent European strategy or political action plan up to now. I propose discussing whether the continuation of this policy is rational in the future. In the current situation we can find a window of opportunity with a strong moral and rational basis to begin a new chapter in our policy. In this new chapter we could make an effort to decrease tensions and/or create the conditions for a temporary ceasefire and/or start peace negotiations.

9. I propose initiating a discussion on the following proposals:

a. the initiative to conduct high-level political talks with China on the modalities of the next peace conference;

b. while maintaining the current high-level political contacts with Ukraine, reopening direct lines of diplomatic communication with Russia and the rehabilitation of such direct contacts in our political communication;

c. the launch of a coordinated political offensive towards the Global South whose appreciation we have lost concerning our position on the war in Ukraine resulting in the global isolation of the transatlantic community.

10. I hope that my reports and suggestions may prove to be a useful contribution to possible proposals and initiatives you will present to EU leaders at an appropriate occasion and in a convenient format.

This post was edited by Malopox on Jul 18 2024 11:25am
Member
Posts: 14,670
Joined: Jun 27 2010
Gold: 100,701.50
Jul 18 2024 01:04pm
Quote (Malopox @ Jul 18 2024 07:25pm)
Viktor Orban has released his statement to Charles Michel - President of the European Council. I think it’s worth posting in full:
https://miniszterelnok.hu/en/report-of-prime-minister-viktor-orban-to-charles-michel-president-of-the-european-council/

Dear President,

Please find below a summary evaluation of my recent discussions with leaders of Ukraine, Russia, China, Türkiye and President Donald J. Trump, as well as a few suggestions for your consideration.

1. It is a general observation that the intensity of the military conflict will radically escalate in the near future.

2. I personally witnessed that the warring parties are determined to involve themselves deeper into the conflict, and neither of them would like to make initiatives for a ceasefire or peace negotiations. Therefore we can assume that tensions will not decrease and the parties will not start searching for a way out of the conflict without significant external involvement.

3. There are three global players that are able to influence developments: the European Union, the United States and China. We also have to take into consideration as an important regional player Türkiye as the only successful mediator between Ukraine and Russia since the outbreak of the hostilities in 2022.

4. China will continue its policy also formulated in international documents calling for a ceasefire and peace talks. However, China will play a more active role only if the chance for success of its engagement is close to certain. In their evaluation this is not the case at the moment.

5. With regards to the United States, I experienced at the NATO Summit and during my talks with President Trump that the US is at the moment heavily preoccupied with the presidential campaign. The incumbent President is making immense efforts to stay in the race. It is obvious that he is not capable of modifying the current US pro-war policy and therefore cannot be expected to start a new policy. As we have witnessed many times over the past years, in these situations bureaucracy without political leadership will continue to go down the previous path.

6. During my talks with President Trump, I came to a conclusion that foreign policy will play only a small role in his campaign, which is dominated by internal political questions. Therefore we can expect no peace initiative coming from him until the elections. I can however surely state that shortly after his election victory, he will not wait until his inauguration, but will be ready to act as a peace broker immediately. He has detailed and well-founded plans for this.

7. I am more than convinced that in the likely outcome of the victory of President Trump, the proportion of the financial burden between the US and the EU will significantly change to the EU’s disadvantage when it comes to the financial support of Ukraine.

8. Our European strategy in the name of transatlantic unity has copied the pro-war policy of the US. We have not had a sovereign and independent European strategy or political action plan up to now. I propose discussing whether the continuation of this policy is rational in the future. In the current situation we can find a window of opportunity with a strong moral and rational basis to begin a new chapter in our policy. In this new chapter we could make an effort to decrease tensions and/or create the conditions for a temporary ceasefire and/or start peace negotiations.

9. I propose initiating a discussion on the following proposals:

a. the initiative to conduct high-level political talks with China on the modalities of the next peace conference;

b. while maintaining the current high-level political contacts with Ukraine, reopening direct lines of diplomatic communication with Russia and the rehabilitation of such direct contacts in our political communication;

c. the launch of a coordinated political offensive towards the Global South whose appreciation we have lost concerning our position on the war in Ukraine resulting in the global isolation of the transatlantic community.

10. I hope that my reports and suggestions may prove to be a useful contribution to possible proposals and initiatives you will present to EU leaders at an appropriate occasion and in a convenient format.


Orban is one of the few realists in the entire EU.

I hope Trump wins the elections in November so he and guys like Orban get a chance to put together a real peace initiative.
Member
Posts: 34,154
Joined: Jul 2 2007
Gold: 316.37
Jul 18 2024 01:46pm
https://www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/no-silver-bullet/

Quote
KEY POINTS
Delayed or insufficient Western aid is often blamed for Ukraine’s lack of success on the battlefield. The truth is more complicated. There is no aid “silver bullet” for what ails Ukraine’s war effort. More aid alone is unlikely to make a decisive difference in the outcome of the war, especially if Ukraine’s structural disadvantages and strategic deficiencies remain unaddressed.
More aid is unlikely to fundamentally change the conflict because Ukraine lacks the manpower necessary to use it to generate enough new combat power to retake lost territory. Moreover, the West does not currently possess the industrial capacity needed to fulsomely sustain an indefinite Ukrainian war effort.
Russian adaptability and battlefield innovation have successfully blunted the effectiveness of several Western weapon systems. And Ukrainian doctrine and tactics remain suboptimal even in the third year of the war, meaning Kyiv has failed to employ the aid it does receive with maximal effectiveness.
Neither Washington nor Kyiv has articulated a clear theory of victory for Ukraine. Western aid was always a stopgap to buy Ukraine time, not a regime-change project to bring about the dissolution of the Russian state.
Instead of continuing to placate maximalist fantasies of total victory, the U.S. should advocate for a shift to a defensive strategy and openness to a negotiated settlement that ends the war, such that a sovereign and independent Ukrainian state can be preserved in the face of fighting to collapse.


Russia has overcome a number of challenges since the war's start. It successfully stabilized its front line after a disastrous start, conscripted hundreds of thousands of men, successfully mobilized its industrial base, and gave its technocrats free rein to navigate the country safely through Western sanctions. At this point, there is no immediate prospect of an imminent Russian collapse. Russian forces are advancing across virtually the entire front-line outside of Kherson. The push towards Pokrovsk is now within a few miles of cutting off key Ukrainian supply lines to Kostiantynivka. The Toretsk front has broken down and Russian forces will soon be able to approach Kostiantynivka from the south. The impending capture of Chasiv Yar threatens Kostiantynivka from the east, and makes the defense of that city untenable.

This isn't to say that a Ukrainian breakdown is imminent. Russia is advancing slowly and at cost. But there is no realistic possibility of the war ending in a Ukrainian victory. Ukraine has no chance of mobilizing the men required to obtain the numerical superiority they'd need to successfully assault Russian lines, and were they to try and do so they'd be storming the most fortified defensive lines in Europe since the 2nd world war. It's past time for Western nations to dispel Ukraine of the illusion that they will be able to "contest the initiative" and seize back broad swathes of territory. Every day that sees more Ukrainian territory taken, or Ukraine lines stretched more thin encourages Russia to seek more from any future deal. Back in 2022-2023, it's possible that Russia might have agreed to pause the war on current lines. Now we're at a point where the entire Donbass will almost certainly be lost, and more besides. In the future, we may be talking about the loss of Odessa, Kharkiv, and Dnipro. And there's the ever present risk that as the conflict moves past the heavily defended trench lines in the Donbass, or the heavily fortified lines around the Kharkiv border, that the pace quickens and Ukrainian defenses collapse. The option is between Ukraine accepting the loss of territory or Ukraine existing at all.
Member
Posts: 46,640
Joined: Jan 20 2010
Gold: 22,164.69
Jul 18 2024 01:57pm
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Jul 18 2024 07:48am)
You are one of the above mentioned pro Russian shills.


You know nobody on PARD has ever given any weight to you going around calling posters russian shills right. We've been here long enough we know the motivations and ideologies of the regulars and you just can't seem to wrap your head around the fact that rational people of diverse viewpoints won't hop on board America's latest doomed forever war. Personally I cannot wrap my head around how you don't get it. Its plainly obvious we're losing this proxy war and it isn't going to end any better than Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Vietnam, etc. After so many misadventures it should be a presumption that the next one will end the same, but here you are impugning peoples motives for having the base pattern recognition skills of a cocker spaniel, which you apparently lack
Member
Posts: 26,100
Joined: Aug 11 2013
Gold: 13,670.00
Jul 18 2024 03:19pm
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Jul 18 2024 07:50am)



I have little sympathy for hired killers. You make your own judgements.


No one is expecting you to have sympathy, going out of your way to laugh at about someone dying and then posting their face as a joke is really not about sympathy. It's mostly about just having basic respect for the dead, respect for their kids, parents, loved ones. It's the type of respect that's common even amongst enemies. Respect that is shared in most wars, even was extended to German soldiers guilty of atrocities in WW2 and many others historically.

Why are you the only one that consistently keeps posting dead soldiers being dragged by tanks or pics of random dead guys in jest? You ever wonder why literally no other regular does that? Not a single one of us posts dead Ukrainians or Russians, because 1. it's not value adding to a discussion, not even an iota, and 2. as a human with empathy it's respectful to not celebrate that type of shit.

Unfortunately you don't have the emotional intelligence to understand this, and honestly pissing on others graves reveals way more about what a garbage person you are than anything else.
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
Prev1439743984399440044014465Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll