This is wrong on nearly every count.

1. Exporting production isn't merely about labor. It's about facilities and community development. In order to provide the infrastructure to mass produce, extreme amount of investment goes into all aspects of an economy. When that's all being invested into China, not the US, the US, the US worker, and the US consumer does not benefit.
2. By not tariffing goods that come from China at a higher rate, we're encouraging corporations to continue to invest in China (and other nations) in such a way as to harm our infrastructure, production ability, working class, consumers, and government.
3. It is not the job of the United States to improve other nations. We are a trade nation. We produce a ton of shit, sell it to everyone else, produce more, and buy the raw material to produce even more yet. The problem is, as we outsource more of the production, especially high level production, we can no longer afford to produce it.
4. Our healthcare system is neither funded nor the problem of other nations. Just as other nations' economic status is not the problem of the American worker or consumer. Our responsibility is to our nation's prosperity. Nobody else is giving us foreign aid. Nobody else is giving us handouts. The more we give away and the more we outsource, the less we have. There's no reciprocal benefit long term. Because once our currency loses all worth, nobody's going to be there to help us. And the moment we get to a point we no longer produce anything because all corporate production has been outsourced to cheaper nations, and crippling regulation has flatlined small business that might fill the gap, we have nothing.

It's a terrible trend. And one we've been following for a long time. And we can't really compete on the banking spectrum, as England has, because US banks are inherently reliant on the USD which is based almost entirely on the US economy and our unbelievably high ability to pay off our debts. Remove the production value of the nation, remove the ability of the nation to pay it's debts. Simple as that.

You live in California right? Come to the mid-west in rust belt country and you will see the long term ramifications. Tech and outsourcing has eliminated tons of jobs, if your answer is to learn to code then lol.

Yes, I do live in California. I understand that the Rust Belt has been hit particularly hard by free trade but that's because state governments and Congress left them high and dry. I agree that it's immoral to just have an economic transition and not address the consequences. It's also immoral to move away from coal and leave people who depend on those jobs with nothing. If you're going to create a free trade agreement or engage in some sort of economic transformation, you need to have a transition plan for the people who are affected.



I don't think you understand my argument. What do you think I'm arguing?

And the Chinese bourgeoisie are kind enough to put suicide nets around their apple factories so they can get back to work after taking a leap.



Death if unionism has destroyed the midwest. Taken so much money out of working homes.

Right to Work (for less) and all that.

This post was edited by Skinned on May 27 2020 12:52pm

Unions derive their power from collective bargaining. Chinese labor willing to work for pennies has neutered unions as they literally had no threat against the business leaving their town.

Willing vs forced, but hardly a distinction to the shareholder.

In the history of corporations they have to prove that they create some public good in order to exist. It gets hard to do that when you betray your community.

Traditional values all fade away the face of profits or as Karl Marx puts it 'all that is solid melts into air'.

This post was edited by Skinned on May 27 2020 01:08pm

That's one interpretation, the more popular one though is corporations exist for the sole benefit of the investor. Like if i'm an entrepreneur i'm not opening up a business because it will be great for the community, i'm doing so because i want to make money. I'm taking the risk, i'm putting in the work, so why would i socialize the benefits when i'm the only one liable for the hardships/failures.

This post was edited by ofthevoid on May 27 2020 01:12pm

Other than misquoting? You're not arguing shit.

You seem to have this theory that there's a way to outsource labor to communist nations such as China that STILL practice compulsory labor laws (only in 1/3rd of the nation though!), outsource the overwhelming majority of our production AND technology, and it's somehow going to be "okay".

How do you address "displaced workers" aka half the nation? Well, let's give them welfare!

How do you address mounting debt that fails to be offset by a matching increase in GDP? Raise taxes!

How do you address business owners who simply leave or hide incomes in non-US banks? Blame corporations, while taxing small business so heavily it goes out of business.

How do you address corporate abandonment due to overreach at all levels? Nationalize industry!

How do you address outdated production methods and facilities that can't compete with the top of the line innovation seen in China because that's where everything was invested to save costs? Cut welfare benefits, demand the population work more!

How do you address failure to produce adequate raw materials because alloy creation and re-purposing was all outsourced and your nation is tens of trillions in debt yet has a shrinking GDP? Demand citizens work in 50's era conditions, because we can't yet redevelop any of the modern standards.

How do you prevent a revolt from an armed populace being forced to work for lower wages, where their money has less purchasing power than ever, where even Chinese goods are 10x the quality, yet now 10x the cost? Take away their guns.

How do you address growing hunger in newly industrialized areas due to completely shattered supply lines, and a limited amount of farming capacity resulting from those shattered supply lines? Blame the farmers and claim it's their fault. Seizing their lands never hurt anyone, amirite?

The list goes on. We've seen this rabbit hole over and over and over. Even US oil production and refining isn't enough to "save" the nation, if we continue to outsource all of our production. We can NOT drop below a critical rate and compete with China. So when you phrase things nonsensically as "why should we penalize Chinese workers for having lower working conditions" it's simple garbage. US Companies are being allowed to utilize a massive workforce at slave level wages (even for that nation) in order to gain huge profits. Those profits are being put towards further improving Chinese Infrastructure. AKA, the Chinese are NOT the target market. Americans are. So these companies are using Chinese labor to build products that they sell to the US to pay Chinese employees and improve Chinese infrastructure so that they can get MORE money from Americans to pay MORE Chinese labor and build MORE Chinese architecture. This is EXACTLY the kind of result tariffs are designed to PREVENT.

Use your head.

Hes speaking of their origin. The limited liability was originally granted only to entities that served a great public good to justify it.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on May 27 2020 01:53pm

As evidenced by their use of Corporate Scrip to landlock their... Employees, and force them to shop at their own stores. Pretty awesome public good.

Or something?

Maybe you're speaking of some nation other than the US.

This post was edited by InsaneBobb on May 27 2020 02:01pm