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Sep 21 2023 09:17am
Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 21 2023 05:02pm)
It’s a very easy explanation. Most of Europe was willing to give away their Soviet era leftovers, especially as the US promised to basically replace it with more modern weapons. Those are gone. Now the euros are being asked to buy and actually pony up the cash for war to continue. Even the most ardent supporters like Poland are chafing at it. These aren’t rich nations and when you combine much higher energy costs and how they are spurring inflation, they can’t really keep feeding hundreds of millions into Ukraine when domestic inflation in places like Poland and Baltic states is over 10%. At some point people care more about the price of bread and stop giving a fuck about how Russia will supposedly invade Europe if we don’t continue the war. This is a real threat to politicians in democratic countries. You can only ignore the voters for so long.


True

Russia is winning the long game
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Sep 21 2023 09:29am
Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 21 2023 04:02pm)
It’s a very easy explanation. Most of Europe was willing to give away their Soviet era leftovers, especially as the US promised to basically replace it with more modern weapons. Those are gone. Now the euros are being asked to buy and actually pony up the cash for war to continue. Even the most ardent supporters like Poland are chafing at it. These aren’t rich nations and when you combine much higher energy costs and how they are spurring inflation, they can’t really keep feeding hundreds of millions into Ukraine when domestic inflation in places like Poland and Baltic states is over 10%. At some point people care more about the price of bread and stop giving a fuck about how Russia will supposedly invade Europe if we don’t continue the war. This is a real threat to politicians in democratic countries. You can only ignore the voters for so long.


"The Euros" are not being asked to do anything they have not already pledged ^^

"Over the summer, the EU has sent a clear signal by announcing a new €50 billion multi-year support package to be delivered through 2027, which doubles total EU commitments. The EU’s “Ukraine Facility” is showing a lasting commitment to support Ukraine.  
In addition, there have been important new multi-year commitments from individual European countries, in particular a 4-year military support package of Germany worth €10.5 billion (2024–2027) and Norway’s “Nansen Support Program” worth €6.6 billion over 5 years. Additional multi-year packages were committed by Denmark, UK, Switzerland, Sweden, Portugal, and Lithuania. "

Going beyond 2027 will be the next commitment that has to be made.
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Sep 21 2023 09:30am
he summed it up quite well.
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Sep 21 2023 09:35am
Russia has payed a heavy price in material and personal to create a land bridge to Crimea; Which is now within Ukraine's cruise missile range and paying the price.

Nobody has won anything. If anything Russia is the second best loser after Ukraine.
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Sep 21 2023 09:37am
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Sep 21 2023 09:40am
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Sep 21 2023 12:35pm)
Russia has payed a heavy price in material and personal to create a land bridge to Crimea; Which is now within Ukraine's cruise missile range and paying the price.

Nobody has won anything. If anything Russia is the second best loser after Ukraine.


This is what we in the biz like to call "cope"
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Sep 21 2023 11:12am
The dispute between Ukraine and Poland is pretty easy to explain: the Polish PiS government has a tight election coming up soon and Polish farmers are one of their most vital constituencies. Therefore, they politically have no other choice than to appease the farmers and limit the import of Ukrainian grain.

Zelensky, failing to understand or consider this, has behaved like a bull in a china shop and tried to brute force Poland to remove the grain embargo via the EU. The PiS represents nationlistic and anti-EU voters to whom it would be completely and wholly unacceptable for Poland to be forced to do something against its national self-interest by Brussels. Therefore, these events have again left the Polish government no other choice than to escalate/retaliate.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Sep 21 2023 11:12am
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Sep 21 2023 11:19am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Sep 21 2023 06:12pm)
The dispute between Ukraine and Poland is pretty easy to explain: the Polish PiS government has a tight election coming up soon and Polish farmers are one of their most vital constituencies. Therefore, they politically have no other choice than to appease the farmers and limit the import of Ukrainian grain.

Zelensky, failing to understand or consider this, has behaved like a bull in a china shop and tried to brute force Poland to remove the grain embargo via the EU. The PiS represents nationlistic and anti-EU voters to whom it would be completely and wholly unacceptable for Poland to be forced to do something against its national self-interest by Brussels. Therefore, these events have again left the Polish government no other choice than to escalate/retaliate.


well said.
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Sep 21 2023 11:40am
lol how the ukraine cheerleaders went from "support ukraine or you are putin" to "poland has every right do whatever" on a dime

absolutely ridiculous, just face it: ukraine gets dropped like a hot potato
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Sep 21 2023 11:43am
How Putin supporters went from Kiev in 3 days to celebrating Poland not sending military aid.

Face it. Paper tiger.
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