Look, most of us live in the western world, and the worlds policeman has been very good to us, but this war in ukraine did not occur because putin wanted to expand russia/imperialism or w/e. It happened after the US destabilized the status quo, after russian repeated warnings. The US is busy destabilizing georgia and as you probably know they are in alot of other places too.

Your right, Russia should not have invaded Ukraine, they should have done a better job replacing the existing ukrainian government (like the US did) and replaced it with a pro russian one, except russia is not as good at that as the US is.

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 16 2023 04:48pm

Both can be true though. We destabilized the status quo with the coup and then further fomenting a war and they are imperialistic. Russia wants it's sphere, just like China wants it's sphere, while we are building 'defensive' (it's really hilarious to even frame something as defensive thousands of miles away on someone else's border) military alliances on their borders.

This is so foolish... Ukraine voted for candidates who were not Kremling puppets, despite the all the intimidations from Putin's regime.

Ruscim (which means regaining old russian empire) NEVER WAS a statu-quo.

Putin's personal writings say differently.

Have you read them yourself?

Yep they votes for américain puppet .

If you put to one side the current narrative spun in the west about putin (i know this is hard), and ignore for a moment any toxic users that may respond to my post between now and when you read this, there were clear tell signs throughout the last 20years that indicated that Russia was not happy with what Nato was doing. If you look specifically at events relating to Ukraine, you can see and read enough about the minsk accords and his attempt to negotiate a deal with the US just before the war, that this was a move of last resort, when all else failed.

Understand I am not talking about right or wrong, I am talking about causes of the conflict. By most accounts (again, ignoring the current MSM narrative) Putin is not an idiot. If he was going to "make russia great again" he would have done it much sooner, say, in the early 2000's. invading ukraine, would ever cause nato to respond, and he knows nato has more stuff. He knows this and yet still he did it. In 2014 he was about to lose his base of operations for his navy, therefore he reacted. The logic then and now looks more like that he saw what was happening as a threat. he has not invaded all of ukraine, he is just securing the parts that he believes he needs. the force that attacked ukraine was not enough to take over the country. the force he currently has is not enough to take over the country. therefore it is a limited invasion. this does not match with the narrative that he wants to invade finland, poland or where-ever.

do you think he wants all of ukraine, and to invade poland/finland etc ? no one knows, its all speculation, but what do you think his aim is here ?

just think about it for a minute.

In order for there to be a resolution to the conflict there needs to be an acknowledgement of the reasons for the conflict.



Ruscim actually means actually racism, against russians, as was pointed out, in the wiki, which you posted.

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 17 2023 02:19am

So a pretty odd moment on Ramaphosa's peace mission
Zelensky drags him into a bunker saying Russia is attacking Kiev and there are explosions nearby. Ramaphosa's spokesman gives a statement afterwards saying nobody on the mission reported seeing or hearing any explosions or sirens or other sign of attack which was conspicuously absent. He even said he was filming out the window of his hotel during the exact time the attack was claimed and saw nothing. Later Ramaphosa gave a speech in which he mentioned 'we witnessed an attack' without any details;


->


???
either they did or they didn't.

This post was edited by Goomshill on Jun 17 2023 02:39am

That’s more or less how I understand it as well, especially if you read the history why Russian Empire fought for Crimea for so many years and wanted Constantinople (Istanbul) as a part of Sykes-Picot partitioning of the collapsing Ottoman Empire. That would have enabled uninterrupted access to international waters out of warm water ports of the Black Sea.

This is why Turkey was one of the first countries to join NATO - to cut off USSRs access through Dardanelles and handicap fleet operations out of Sevastopol/Nikolayev/Odessa/Novorossiysk.



We’ve long established that pierre is not capable of understanding the links he posts. He (or She?) is a propaganda boy (girl?).

This post was edited by Malopox on Jun 17 2023 02:42am

Translations of excerpts. I don't read in Russian like you.



He wanted the war. The negotiations prior to the war were a farce. He was insisting that Ukraine negotiate with his puppets. His puppets were claiming to support the Minsk Agreement (which calls for a whole and sovereign Ukraine) while simultaneously working to break those oblasts off of Ukraine. They're now members of the Russian Duma. Putin has been waging wars of expansion since the moment he got into office: Chechnya (1999), Georgia (2008), Ukraine (2014), Ukraine (2022). The simple fact here is that Russians have viewed Ukraine as theirs since 1764. Also, he did try to invade the whole country, he just found out right quick that his Large Modern army is actually 2 armies: the Large part isn't modern, and the Modern part isn't large, and that they weren't equipped to do what they set out to do: quickly end the war with a decapitating strike. It's a "limited invasion" NOW, because reality has set the Russists straight.

In order for there to be a resolution to the conflict, Russia needs to be evicted from Ukraine. They could have simply kept leasing the base at Sevastopol. The US leases Guantanamo Bay naval station from Cuba, with which we haven't been on good terms for the better part of a century.