A dragon nonetheless. Russia is welcome to join as a friendly number 2. But instead theyre busy protecting Russia from gays and junkies while its drowning in its alcohol problem.

Ukraine was, and still is, a highly corrupt state, but it's people are more free, its press is more free and its not cracking down on its people like Russia does. It has expressed willingness to align itself with Western values of democracy, human rights and the freedom of speech and the press. False dichotomies aren't clever tricks, but a way of derailing conversations ad nauseam, i think you know that? We can do this for all countries, but equating EU countries to Russia is just dishonest. Of course no country is perfect and i'm as worried as you are about the signs that we see in Western countries.

Because the US doesnt want to use nukes, whose threshold is high enough, and the stronger your conventional army, the less likely you need to use WMDs. Yes i know how much the US uses on its army. Its to stay nr 1. Is it worth it? Idk, but were not talking about US politics here.

find me a pow killing vid before the one released in kharkiv by kraken.

Ill wait for it.

Ukr started, especially the georgians. Then russians did it back. Then both sides normalized it.

Doesn´t really matter, it wouldve ended up like this either way because people are inherently stupid.

This post was edited by ownyaah on May 31 2023 04:40pm

Well I think they are relevant since the West is funding Ukraine as the bastion of truth, freedom and democracy in Europe.

Doesn't mean I'm surprised by it though, I assume far worse things have been done by both sides, but if they videotaped that and used it for propaganda I would most likely disparage it as well

At this point it doesnt really matter, personally I wouldn´t see surrender as an option regardless of which side i fought on

Maybe they should have been allowed into NATO? It doesn't really seem like they are, or have ever been welcome.

Protecting them from gays and junkies? What is the proper way for them to deal with LGBT issues? Do the Russian people get any say in that or just western governments? How do you want Russian policy decided, exactly? In Washington? Or maybe Brussels?

Most people don't like junkies, have you ever met one? I would prefer my own government was harsher towards them. Watch a video of the homeless problem in Los Angeles or the opioid epidemic in the US in general, is that how a progressive modern society should handle drug addiction?

Who is the arbiter of who is more or less free and do you think they have any bias? And sure Ukraine has expressed willingness to pursue Western values, and it hasn't done a great job of it, almost as if a notoriously poor and corrupt country might lie for financial benefit.

So none of those things that apply to the US not using nuclear weapons apply to Russia? You said it doesn't fear NATO because it has nukes, but you just made the case that a country doesn't want to settle every problem with nukes.

And yes we are talking about US politics here.

That is probably the case yeah, to me that seems like more reason not to send endless amounts of weapons though

What happened yesterday and today is important: Uk, Germany, saying that Ukraine has all the rights to defend itself by hitting enemy in its own territory, and Macron doing a 90° on his previous stances, actively supporting the war "as long as necessary" etc
Americans not officially supporting it but probably happy, considering the "US BAD" bitching. All this means only 1 thing: weapons will continue to flow even if Ukraine sends drones to russian towns, military bases, infrastrctures. Whatever they would do it to increase invader internal political tensions or to mobilize their AA defense out of the front line. There's one way for peace: The end of Putin.

Ukraine has every right to attack military or political targets on Russian soil, but they should imho really strive to avoid civilian collateral damage as much as possible. Time for them to show the world that they are indeed better than Russia which is indiscriminately bombing civilian infrastructure.

That ship has sort of already sailed, unless bombing your own civilian infrastructure doesn't count.

This just sums up to more escalation, not in any way shape or form enough for Ukraine to actually defeat Russia
Russia is methodically razing Ukrainian cities to the ground. They are pounding Ukraine every day. If NATO can send some drones by proxy to land a few hits on Moscow or military bases or infrastructure, its not going to stop Russia, its just going to continue dramatically raising the stakes and risks of direct confrontation between east and west or nuclear escalation. Its just yet another helping of 'this won't change the outcome for the better, but risks changing it massively for the worse'.