no they are not justified at all. where did we say it is justified ? we are outlining why each side is doing what it is doing without talking about what is justified and what is not. We are not prescribing fairness to any side here, we are simply acknowledging what we are seeing and why it is happening.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 25 2022 10:10am

ahem. yes.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 25 2022 10:13am

Incredible, after massacring civilians in mariupol, Russia officially announce its main objective is reached and now retreat to free up Donbas.
I doubt this will lift sanctions easily. This situation may stay like this for a very long time.

/e To summarize it: Putin tried to steal Ukraine, failed, and now retreat to consolidate the Donbas annexation

This post was edited by Saucisson6000 on Mar 25 2022 10:20am

to support the above claim ~

China News: Russian defense ministry Friday said that in general, the main tasks of the first stage of Russian "special military operation" in Ukraine have been completed. On ongoing peace talks with Ukraine, Russian chief negotiator Friday said that there has been no progress on main political issues



I think alot of doors are closed now permanently during Putins lifetime. I dont expect certain sanctions to be ever lifted after this event until such time as there is a new Russian leader + X event (where X event is unknown).

/e in terms of "failed" we need to see what political objectives are achieved. I really dont see Russia simply retreating as noting "Russian chief negotiator Friday said that there has been no progress on main political issues"

News from China & noting Rueters input nodded to (i.e. I would accept this at face value) ~ Russia is seeking a comprehensive deal in talks with Ukraine covering a whole range of issues, without which coming to an agreement is unlikely, the Interfax news agency cited Russian negotiator Vladimir Medinsky as saying on Friday. Medinsky said that without the demilitarization, denazification of Ukraine, the recognition of Crimea and Donbas, the conclusion of an agreement with Kyiv is unlikely. He said Moscow believes Kyiv is trying to stretch out the negotiations. Earlier he said the two sides were making little progress on the key issues. (With input from Reuters)

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 25 2022 10:25am

That's what lebanon was arguing, see here:

I'm suspecting they (Putin) could have left some troops or whatever trap in order to assassinate Zelinsky & crew, later.
IMO They can't simply stick on keeping their position, not with heavily weaponized enraged ukrainians all around.

attempts to maintaining sovereign security should not be at the expense of another countries security concerns. The chinese said that about this conflict. Ehmm, what you have quoted is not the same thing as justifying the targeting of civilian structures.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 25 2022 10:32am

"He's got nukes" is not a good enough argument to let Putin get away with absolutely everything while we stand by and do nothing. In reality, the West is already acknowledging the Russian nukes. That's the very reason why there are no Nato or EU troops standing is Kyiv already. Judging by how weak the Russian military has presented itself so far, even just a small contingent of Western troops would be enough to quickly and decisively turn the tide of this war.

Without Russian nukes, this war would already have ended with a crushing Russian defeat.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Mar 25 2022 10:33am

ehmm this is an oxymoron statement.

/e sec i see your edit. let me requote



Yes, Without Russian nukes, this war would already have ended with a crushing Russian defeat *but then this scenario does not exist in this reality noting if Russia did not have Nukes then the entire path of history in the last 80 odd years would have been different*.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 25 2022 10:36am