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Feb 14 2020 03:39pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ 14 Feb 2020 21:25)
Most Bernie and Trump supporters are already calling Buttigieg out for being an obvious plant. Center-left Democrats might still like him, but I dont think that he will gain traction in more diverse primary states.


i wouldn't necessarily go with 'plant'. his absolute desire to become president one day seems genuine, his whole vita suggests that. every major choice he made in his life seems to have been made with that goal in mind. obviously his lack of principles / convictions / a concrete vision, as well as his willingness to do whatever it takes, make him the ideal vehicle for those who are looking to invest into a promising, smart, eloquent, fresh-faced candidate without any major skeletons in his closet, and he embraces that wholeheartedly - but to me the term 'plant' suggests that he was groomed to be all that, whereas i think his motivation is real, just the 'substance' (or rather the lack thereof) is interchangeable and for sale...

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Feb 14 2020 03:43pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 14 Feb 2020 21:51)
Two things that are more corrections rather than disagreements with your general direction. Bernie per his 1st debate answer is still calling for "strong border security" and hasnt been one of the "dont prosecute illegals" candidates that i remember. makes sense being that his staple issue is healthcare, which only get harder to pay for as illegals stream in. and secondly like 50k people TOTAL work in coal. i only correct that because it's idiotic that coal is a talking point while being such a small sector. coal country is big, job losses in coal are big, but no amount of protectionism for the coal industry will bring enough jobs back to save those areas. they're fucked, proper. unless someone makes a sector move there through tax incentives, and i dont think that will happen because the general infrastructure in those areas is also bad. but thats possible.


two words: electoral college
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Feb 14 2020 03:53pm
Quote (Skinned @ Feb 14 2020 03:23pm)
I don't think all of even most Americans share your biased and subjective and ultimately intractable view.

If you work for a living you have nothing to fear from this man. I think a lot of American voters actually care about who a person is and what they've done, not the Fox News hype.

Then again about 47% of adults who vote voted for a reality television star who makes fun of disabled people and used sexual aggression to let women know he is interested in sexual congress lol.


I would say he's right. Most people don't want open borders, an end to ICE/CBP, or the green new deal. Those are not moderate policies.

Policy is #1.

My guess is Trump has a recordbreaking win this year. Hell, we could even see a collapse of the Democratic party with how split apart they've become. All they've done is talked people out of voting for them.
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Feb 14 2020 03:57pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Feb 14 2020 12:51pm)
Two things that are more corrections rather than disagreements with your general direction. Bernie per his 1st debate answer is still calling for "strong border security" and hasnt been one of the "dont prosecute illegals" candidates that i remember. makes sense being that his staple issue is healthcare, which only get harder to pay for as illegals stream in. and secondly like 50k people TOTAL work in coal. i only correct that because it's idiotic that coal is a talking point while being such a small sector. coal country is big, job losses in coal are big, but no amount of protectionism for the coal industry will bring enough jobs back to save those areas. they're fucked, proper. unless someone makes a sector move there through tax incentives, and i dont think that will happen because the general infrastructure in those areas is also bad. but thats possible.



It gets easier to pay for as they stream in because they pay taxes and usually don't have access to benefits.
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Feb 14 2020 04:04pm
Bernie Sanders is not for "open borders" just to cut the crap thanks ^_^
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Feb 14 2020 04:18pm
Quote (GLYC123 @ Feb 14 2020 04:53pm)
I would say he's right. Most people don't want open borders, an end to ICE/CBP, or the green new deal. Those are not moderate policies.

Policy is #1.

My guess is Trump has a recordbreaking win this year. Hell, we could even see a collapse of the Democratic party with how split apart they've become. All they've done is talked people out of voting for them.


Trump is definitely cruising to reelection.
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Feb 14 2020 04:21pm
Quote (Skinned @ 14 Feb 2020 22:23)
I don't think all of even most Americans share your biased and subjective and ultimately intractable view.

If you work for a living you have nothing to fear from this man. I think a lot of American voters actually care about who a person is and what they've done, not the Fox News hype.


Well, Bernie isnt shy about his plans to end all current healthcare plans and replace them with his government-run single-payer "medicare for all" system, for which he will have to raise middle class taxes.
So to sell voters on this plan, he really has to convince them that 1. M4A would really be practical, 2. M4A would really reduce their overall financial situation despite the tax hike and 3. that the government could really pull off this mammoth task without fucking it up.

Essentially, Bernie is asking voters for a huge leap of faith, with their healthcare plans on the line. Even voters who are convinced that a single-payer healthcare system would be preferable to the status quo on healthcare might be wary of putting this much trust in a huge, government-run program.

In this sense, I disagree with the notion that ordinary middle- or working-class voters have nothing to fear from Bernie. He's a risky bet even for those who believe in his ideas.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Feb 14 2020 04:21pm
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Feb 14 2020 04:23pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Feb 14 2020 05:21pm)
Well, Bernie isnt shy about his plans to end all current healthcare plans and replace them with his government-run single-payer "medicare for all" system, for which he will have to raise middle class taxes.
So to sell voters on this plan, he really has to convince them that 1. M4A would really be practical, 2. M4A would really reduce their overall financial situation despite the tax hike and 3. that the government could really pull off this mammoth task without fucking it up.

Essentially, Bernie is asking voters for a huge leap of faith, with their healthcare plans on the line. Even voters who are convinced that a single-payer healthcare system would be preferable to the status quo on healthcare might be wary of putting this much trust in a huge, government-run program.

In this sense, I disagree with the notion that ordinary middle- or working-class voters have nothing to fear from Bernie. He's a risky bet even for those who believe in his ideas.


The president signs laws into effect that are given to him by congress. He also has veto power, which can be overridden by a bipartisan congress.
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Feb 14 2020 04:25pm
Quote (fender @ 14 Feb 2020 22:39)
i wouldn't necessarily go with 'plant'. his absolute desire to become president one day seems genuine, his whole vita suggests that. every major choice he made in his life seems to have been made with that goal in mind. obviously his lack of principles / convictions / a concrete vision, as well as his willingness to do whatever it takes, make him the ideal vehicle for those who are looking to invest into a promising, smart, eloquent, fresh-faced candidate without any major skeletons in his closet, and he embraces that wholeheartedly - but to me the term 'plant' suggests that he was groomed to be all that, whereas i think his motivation is real, just the 'substance' (or rather the lack thereof) is interchangeable and for sale...


You're right in that I was using too strong language. There are several red flags and indications that Buttigieg might have been groomed for his role, but it's far from definitive proof. So saying with convinction that he definitely is a plant not justified at this point. It is a possibility though, I'm kinda torn on that. The talk about "CIA Pete" screams of conspiracy talk, but the red flags and indications are real.

Either way, I dont trust the guy, and the fact that he's reeking of careerism is not an argument in his favor if you ask me.
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Feb 14 2020 04:29pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Feb 14 2020 05:25pm)
You're right in that I was using too strong language. There are several red flags and indications that Buttigieg might have been groomed for his role, but it's far from definitive proof. So saying with convinction that he definitely is a plant not justified at this point. It is a possibility though, I'm kinda torn on that. The talk about "CIA Pete" screams of conspiracy talk, but the red flags and indications are real.

Either way, I dont trust the guy, and the fact that he's reeking of careerism is not an argument in his favor if you ask me.


I was groomed for my job now and am currently being groomed now by another agency. What is wrong with this?

All these politicians have been groomed to become who they are.
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