Quote (Nibthebarb @ Mar 21 2022 08:34pm)

Yeah, they surely want to legitimize those breakaway republics so they can be absorbed and annexed. To me, I think Russia hasn't gained enough leverage to ask for the whole kit 'n kaboodle - not to mention, Zelenskyy has already conceded NATO membership. It wouldn't be too difficult to get international consensus on the recognition of Crimea as legitimate Russian territory (in a sane world) due to the referendum voting overwhelmingly for that. Whereas Donesk and Luhansk smell a lot more like bullshit, though something would need to be done there to assuage the local violence and tensions. I'm just not sure that means being annexed by Russia. Or maybe, that's exactly what they need.

"Fortunately", Putin's media machine will spin absolutely any outcome as roundly positive and a crushing victory. I'm more than happy to let the baby have his bottle if it means an end to the carnage and worldwide economic troubles. But realistically, I do think this will be dragged out much longer than it needs to be by the arrogance of all sides involved.

Putin is a bad guy. But I don't care enough to sacrifice America's long term health. It baffles me that so many people on here think it's in America's best interest to bear the brunt of this much economic blowback just to resolve a border conflict in Ukraine. Maybe these people don't know the sheer mind-boggling volume of the world's resources are inside Russia's borders, and need to be available for purchase on the open market. Not for Russia's benefit, but for everyone else's.

Quote (Nibthebarb @ 22 Mar 2022 08:34)

Yeah, they surely want to legitimize those breakaway republics so they can be absorbed and annexed. To me, I think Russia hasn't gained enough leverage to ask for the whole kit 'n kaboodle - not to mention, Zelenskyy has already conceded NATO membership. It wouldn't be too difficult to get international consensus on the recognition of Crimea as legitimate Russian territory (in a sane world) due to the referendum voting overwhelmingly for that. Whereas Donesk and Luhansk smell a lot more like bullshit, though something would need to be done there to assuage the local violence and tensions. I'm just not sure that means being annexed by Russia. Or maybe, that's exactly what they need.

"Fortunately", Putin's media machine will spin absolutely any outcome as roundly positive and a crushing victory. I'm more than happy to let the baby have his bottle if it means an end to the carnage and worldwide economic troubles. But realistically, I do think this will be dragged out much longer than it needs to be by the arrogance of all sides involved.

Putin is a bad guy. But I don't care enough to sacrifice America's long term health. It baffles me that so many people on here think it's in America's best interest to bear the brunt of this much economic blowback just to resolve a border conflict in Ukraine. Maybe these people don't know the sheer mind-boggling volume of the world's resources are inside Russia's borders, and need to be available for purchase on the open market. Not for Russia's benefit, but for everyone else's.

Quote (Hamsterbaby @ Mar 21 2022 05:05pm)

Correct me if I am wrong.

Ukraine and Russia holds alot of wheat production right ?

And Russia also hold alot of Titanium

Quote (Nibthebarb @ 22 Mar 2022 09:14)

Russia and Ukraine export a huge proportion of world wheat, Russia being the #1 exporter

Russia, or countries within the Russian economic sphere (Kazakhstan) have shit loads of things we literally need to live:
Oil
Natural Gas
Potash

And things we need to run modern civilization:
Titanium
Nickel
Uranium

Quote (Nibthebarb @ 22 Mar 2022 02:14)

Russia and Ukraine export a huge proportion of world wheat, Russia being the #1 exporter

Russia, or countries within the Russian economic sphere (Kazakhstan) have shit loads of things we literally need to live:
Oil
Natural Gas
Potash

And things we need to run modern civilization:
Titanium
Nickel
Uranium

Quote (realgeizt @ 22 Mar 2022 09:17)

And they need imports from other countries.

Quote (Hamsterbaby @ Mar 21 2022 05:15pm)

What are your predictions, when will they cease fire

Quote (Black XistenZ @ 22 Mar 2022 00:21)

I think the Russians will also insist on Ukraine officially acknowledging the "People's Republics of Donezk and Luhansk". This would give Putin a good argument to save face with his own people. His propaganda machine could spin such an outcome as "we had to intervene in Ukraine to prevent a genocide against the ethnic Russians in Donbass, and we succeeded. Our heroic efforts repelled the aggressors and crushed their nazi hordes. VICTORY!!!!!111"

Quote (Nibthebarb @ 22 Mar 2022 09:20)

No idea.

But... gun to my head, I'll say that in 1 month Kiev will be considered occupied by Russian forces, which will call for more serious brokered peace negotiations. Putin will continue pushing for NATO+Crimea+Donbass and Ukraine will at that point only push back on Donbass. The Western world will continue to insist that the carnage continue, and political pressure within Russia may force Putin to accept less than perfect gains.

Quote (Hamsterbaby @ Mar 21 2022 05:26pm)

China's role ?