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Mar 19 2019 07:32pm
Quote (InsaneBobb @ Mar 19 2019 06:01pm)
I firmly believe that all drugs should be legal with the exception of antibiotics. Antibiotics should be heavily restricted, due to the obvious risks. All painkillers, opiates, etc. should simply be legalized, regulated regarding age of use, taxed, and massed produced in a safe fashion. Want heroin, meth, crack? Great! Purchase it. At an affordable rate. From a drug store. No prescription, no nothing. Toothache, gotta wait for the dentists? Vicodin from the corner mart should get you through to your appointment. I don't give a fuck. Why are we inflicting pain, and preventing addiction, among people who have the right to choose for themselves? Restrict children. Other than that? Regulate safety, call it good, make a killing in taxes.

Come at me bro.


You think antibiotics should be restricted.... but opiates shouldn't be.

I'm trying to find any possible way that makes sense. The capacity for abuse is orders of magnitude greater for opiates than antibiotics.
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Mar 19 2019 07:36pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Mar 19 2019 05:32pm)
You think antibiotics should be restricted.... but opiates shouldn't be.

I'm trying to find any possible way that makes sense. The capacity for abuse is orders of magnitude greater for opiates than antibiotics.


inb4 antibiotic resistance.
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Mar 20 2019 04:52pm
Quote (inkanddagger @ Mar 19 2019 07:21pm)
@bogie, I have to go back to this again, because I don't think you'll get what I just wrote (being small picture minded and all).

Environmental risk has been on the radar for lenders since at least the Nixon era, when courts began forcing some measure of responsibility on banks for the polluting factories, Superfund (CERCLA) sites and other environmental problems that had, to one degree or another, been facilitated by their financing. Congress passed laws in 1996 that limited the exposure of lenders on this front.

So AOC's line of questioning is important because it highlights the damage done after the shift in policies in the late 90s.

Back in the Nixon era it was easy to decide not to lend if, for example, your potential borrower is dumping cyanide in a river.

But if they’re dumping carbon dioxide into the air for example (not exactly illegal yet) it makes the decision more difficult. Banks are in kind of a quandary because they are competing for business and they risk allowing other banks to take that business if they self-impose regulatory standards.

So what AOC is setting up is a legal framework to bring lenders themselves into compliance with environmental standards akin to those they were used to before 1996, but now with an emphasis on the climate crisis (sure, pipeline spills are also underlying this conversation but let's not insult each other's intelligence, targeting pipelines is about production and ultimately the climate).

This clarifies and codifies lending standards, and prevents unfair competition from "tethered" banks... so it also protects capitalist/market interests while protecting the environment.

So it's really quite a brilliant move that is 100% in line with the goals of social democracy (protecting capitalism while increasing regulatory standards and quality of life).

I don't agree with her on that protecting capitalism bit and think the banks should truly be made to suffer, but folks like yourself should appreciate her brilliance in protecting the market economy and big banks you all love.


Edit: I would love for you to read this, but at least please skim it (it's quite long and you may not be able to comprehend all if it, unfortunately):

https://www.lexisnexis.com/lexis-practice-advisor/the-journal/b/lpa/posts/lender-liability-under-environmental-laws-in-real-estate-transactions


Ouch, looks like I really touched a nerve there.

I read the entire thing hoping for some fantastic insight, but I left disappointed. Perhaps you might want to reread it and let me know where you think Wells Fargo is running afoul of lender liability laws.

AOC believes that the bank is/ought to be legally liable for the operations management / operations mishaps of the borrower. Obviously, legally not the case. Wells Fargo is not acting in a management capacity, and has presumably followed the legal & regulatory protocols in place.

So we assume she knows this, and is saying "ought". The consequence of applying legal liability to the lender is to curtail lending, as the lender has limited expertise and no control over the operations of the borrower. With no control over operations, and unbounded legal and financial responsibility, even well-funded lenders would find it hard to finance projects that carried any sort of risk.

Worse, a similar result could be realized by passing stricter regulation on the borrower, and punishing the borrower when operations mistakes are made. All as an aside, you have to wonder where this ends. If lenders are legally liable for operations mishaps as it impacts the environment, is the same true for other workplace hazards? Product recalls? Of course, because I can't even begin to see how you differentiate them as issues.

If your goal is to target production, target production. Outlaw oil and let's face the catastrophic financial costs honestly. Adding enormous financial and legal costs to lending is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

This post was edited by bogie160 on Mar 20 2019 04:56pm
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Mar 20 2019 08:33pm
http://jewishinsider.com/15952/at-town-hall-rep-max-rose-apologizes-to-jewish-constituents-for-omars-rhetoric/?fbclid=IwAR2AdY9HCLDVzPRwPgZ5ft3qUSeb3fObWMlTuCk0bGLXhIrbDenqOr9kKew

the absolute state of the democratic party in 2016:

Quote
Rep. Max Rose (D-NY) began his town hall meeting with Jewish constituents on Tuesday night with an apology. “As a young congressman, I’ve got to tell you I’m sorry,” Rose confessed to the crowd gathered by the Council of Jewish Organizations (COJO) of Staten Island. “You sent me to Congress to take responsibility. You sent me to Congress to have your back… and I failed you. Because I know that Congresswoman Ilhan Omar’s comments really caused you all a lot of pain by bringing up anti-Semitic tropes.”

Rose referenced his own military service to hit back at the charge of ‘dual allegiances’ among the Jewish community. “Certainly as a Jewish combat veteran, I could tell you I don’t have dual allegiance,” Rose declared. “I have allegiance to the flag. I have allegiance to the United States of America.”

While Rose acknowledged his inability to prevent his colleague, Rep. Omar, from offending the Jewish community, he also defended the Democratic leadership’s handling of the issue. In particular, the decision from leadership to not seek the removal of the Minnesota representative from the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Removing a member from a committee is an “escalating” situation, Rose stressed during one of the town hall’s more contentious moments. “We have got to show her that there is a pathway for her to do the right thing, and we have to be vigilant towards that. Believe me, she understands that that’s a possibility and nobody is taking that off the table, but we are not there yet.”

“Let me be very honest with you,” the New York freshman continued as he stepped off the stage and walked closer to the attendee challenging him on the matter. “I was horrified and sad when she made the comments. So horrified that as a freshman member of Congress I stepped in front of my party’s leadership and I was the first member of the Democratic Party to criticize her. I did say that I accepted her apology. You know why I did that? Because I am an adult. Because my goal was to continue the quiet and non-glamorous actions of coalition-building and trying to protect the people in this room from those comments being made.”

But the New York freshman also expressed dissatisfaction with Congresswoman Omar’s rhetoric. “I am not satisfied with what I’ve seen thus far, I’m not,” he stated. “To equate Jewish organizations with the NRA, of course I’m upset. Of course I’m not satisfied and I don’t know any who are either. That’s why the first thing that I said is that ‘I’m sorry,’ I’m sorry because I couldn’t protect you from this. And that takes a lot to say.”

Rose concluded by pledging to “work as hard as I can to make sure that these comments are not made again.”


jews have to apologize to jews on behalf of the muslim who won't apologize for being anti-jewish
and he turns around and says we need to be patient and give her another opportunity. This is her third anti-semitic incident and she's unrepentant

This post was edited by Goomshill on Mar 20 2019 08:34pm
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Mar 20 2019 08:46pm
https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/20/politics/moveon-2020-aipac/index.html

another showdown brewing
AIPAC is holding its annual policy conference in Washington next week.
Quote
"We are formally asking 2020 presidential candidates to not attend the conference," Iram Ali, MoveOn's campaign director, told CNN on Wednesday.




Quote
"AIPAC has been known to peddle anti-Muslim and anti-Arab rhetoric while giving platforms to islamaphobes," Ali said.
After being presented with those arguments in a poll, 74.3% of MoveOn members said candidates should skip AIPAC, according to the release.
AIPAC did not respond to CNN's request for comment. CNN is reaching out to the Democratic campaigns to ask if they plan on attending the conference.
Netanyahu, Vice President Mike Pence, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy are scheduled to speak at the conference, which runs from Sunday through Tuesday.




guess which one is Iram Ali

This post was edited by Goomshill on Mar 20 2019 08:47pm
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Mar 21 2019 02:46am
Quote (Goomshill @ 21 Mar 2019 03:46)


Quote (Goomshill @ 21 Mar 2019 03:33)
http://jewishinsider.com/15952/at-town-hall-rep-max-rose-apologizes-to-jewish-constituents-for-omars-rhetoric/?fbclid=IwAR2AdY9HCLDVzPRwPgZ5ft3qUSeb3fObWMlTuCk0bGLXhIrbDenqOr9kKew

the absolute state of the democratic party in 2016:

jews have to apologize to jews on behalf of the muslim who won't apologize for being anti-jewish
and he turns around and says we need to be patient and give her another opportunity. This is her third anti-semitic incident and she's unrepentant





They are in full self-destruction mode. The rift within their caucus is already huge, and leadership will have a really hard time keeping it patched up going forward.

If the Democrats lose a significant portion of Jewish Americans, they are in for a world of trouble. And on top of that, a full-blown anti-semitism problem of their own would really weaken their xenophobia accusations against Trump.
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Mar 21 2019 11:54am
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/amy-klobuchar-was-a-tough-on-crime-prosecutor-will-a-diverse-democratic-base-accept-her-record/2019/03/21/739e6984-4057-11e9-9361-301ffb5bd5e6_story.html

they still got knives out for amy klobuchar
every time I see an article like this printed, I revise my forecast for democratic ambitions in 2020 downwards

If Amy is successfully shanked that only leaves hickenlooper
Member
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Mar 21 2019 12:30pm
Quote (Goomshill @ 21 Mar 2019 18:54)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/amy-klobuchar-was-a-tough-on-crime-prosecutor-will-a-diverse-democratic-base-accept-her-record/2019/03/21/739e6984-4057-11e9-9361-301ffb5bd5e6_story.html

they still got knives out for amy klobuchar
every time I see an article like this printed, I revise my forecast for democratic ambitions in 2020 downwards

If Amy is successfully shanked that only leaves hickenlooper


I've been saying this for a long time now: they will nominate a ticket of Harris/O'Rourke, they will run on identity politics on steroids and go down in flames when Trump narrowly defeats them once again, with a more than 4 percentage points EC-PV split.
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Mar 21 2019 12:34pm
Quote
Netanyahu, Vice President Mike Pence, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy are scheduled to speak at the conference, which runs from Sunday through Tuesday.


update:

https://apnews.com/7470416d12a84154a6136ee47bd94e78

Quote
Democratic presidential candidates Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders and Kamala Harris won’t attend the American Israel Public Affairs Committee’s annual conference in Washington next week.

Former Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz, who is considering an independent bid for president, will also avoid the conference.


They're boycotting AIPAC
where have I heard this before...
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Mar 21 2019 12:43pm
Quote (Goomshill @ 21 Mar 2019 19:34)
update:

https://apnews.com/7470416d12a84154a6136ee47bd94e78



They're boycotting AIPAC
where have I heard this before...


Isnt this mostly symbolic anyway? Afaik, presidential candidates only appear at AIPAC in election years, not the year before.

So even without this boycott, Warren, Sanders or Harris would not have attended this year's AIPAC. They are placating a rabid base in a way that doesnt hurt them. It's free PR with their base for them.
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