What?

No I literally cannot see

This post was edited by Prox1m1ty on Mar 10 2023 06:08am

My opinion on this. This is a pragmatic move because Russia is not America's greatest threat anymore. China is moving forward. Both countries have nukes, but China have economy and supply chain etc etc
The political hold the CCP have on China is much tighter and stronger than Putin's hold on Russia.

Russia is a threat to Ukraine, yes , but they are not going to swallow up the entire Ukraine. China on the other hand poses an existential threat to the Americans.
Pragmatically speaking it will work better to give the Russians a little more leeway to counter China then to put them both together.

This strategy worked extremely well during the Cold war Era starting from Nixon's time where Kissinger started the Diplomacy with China, thus somehow making China the main front for American's island chain strategy.
The USSR was surrounded by Europe in the West and China, Japan, Taiwan and South East Asia in the East and South East.

Just my superficial opinion.

By being nicey with Russia during Trump's presidency and if that particular strategy works. Putin will not Open up Central Asia for the Chinese, thus halting or stalling their Belt and Road Initiative. When this happens and if this happens, the Americans and the West can re group and solve their domestic issue and be well prepared for a fight that can whip the Chinese left right and center if that happens. This will also force the Chinese to rethink their strategy and be less aggressive because she will be without super powers as potential ally at best a very reluctant ally.

This post was edited by Hamsterbaby on Mar 10 2023 06:11am

Not disagreeing with you, but in what way is China an existential threat to the US?
Or do you mean specifically a threat to US global dominance?

My counter to any response is that China is far more exposed to a breakdown of the current globalized trade system.
Ergo it is not in China's interest to provoke a war with anyone that would involve the US getting involved directly. Namely, Taiwan.

This post was edited by Prox1m1ty on Mar 10 2023 06:14am

1. The US told Ukraine not to defend itself re: Crimea
2. Ergo if they did it once they could have done it again.

Also separately from this, - relating to the Georgia Law (and propaganda in general) I came across this today:





and I agree with that.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 10 2023 06:24am

I really want to try and explain to you better. But I need to think it through thoroughly.

For one, during Obama's time he mentioned that if China's GDP PER CAPITAL comes close to half of what the United States is, the US will lose influence badly around the wold and it will create huge problems for the citizens.

The TPP which Trump cancelled was supposed to be the very first step to counter China's influence in the East
Read here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership

This will affect and " lock up " China's sea route. The fact that the countries mentioned in the above link are huge trading partners with China, China will think twice about pressuring her neighbours. It doesn't bode well for them if they do.
You can semi lock up the Straits of Malacca. And the Chinese did show interest in joining the TPP. But because it is USA Led, she will have to adhere to the "rules and regulations"

With the TPP you control the Belt and Road initiative via the seas. With Russia , you stall the inland route towards the West.
And at that point of time, the Vietnamese government and her President is still very West Friendly.

Just to add the Chinese tried to convince the Thais and the Malaysians to allow them to build the Kra Canal. It will basically be the Panama Canal and the Suez of the East , thus eliminating the straits of Malacca as a potential blockade.

Read Kra Canal here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thai_Canal

But in the End the Thais and Malaysians stop due to " pressure " and also , it is an almost impossible project.

This post was edited by Hamsterbaby on Mar 10 2023 06:31am

Ok but, this doesn't really clarify what existential threat China is to the US.

Right. So its not that Trump could have prevented the invasion and its effects in their entirety; Its that Trump would have appeased Putin over eastern Ukraine.
Well then I'm not surprised at all to hear that being advocated for.

Is it really a congruent position though? Trump was elected in 2016 and during his presidency the US and allies were training and supporting Ukraine's military in response to Russia's annexation of Crimea.

I would invite you read into Putin's demands from late 2021 and tell me if you think that any US president could have agreed to those.

Ok I try to make it short and sweet but you can correct me if I am wrong. I just got off work, was extremely taxing day.

1. If the Chinese Nominal GDP TOTAL over takes USA, it means they have more money to make more weapons , more money to pay for scientist and inventors, more money on STEM. This will be a threat to USA worldwide dominance and influence.

2. With the Tax and money that the central government gets, they will start to spend and influence neighboring countries and buy friends.

3. As bad as how a lot of countries in the West thinks that the products that are China made are absolutely atrocious, we all need to remember such sentiments are the exact same in regards to Japanese Products in the mid 70s up to the early 90s. Look how far the Japanese have achieved within this short period of time

4. When this happens a lot of Chinese industry will be a direct threat to the United States of America and due to cheap wages with potentially better workers and harder working population. This will have a massive effect on America's work force. As a matter of fact the Americans are already facing this right now. Part of the reason why the US wanted to bring as much jobs back to USA as possible. The US already experienced this once with the Japanese Automobile industry so they have have experience in what will happen if they don't beat the Chinese down asap.

5. With the Japanese , it is much easier to handle, with the Chinese it is a completely different game.

6. When this happens the citizens will be pissed at the people in power , whether republican or democrat, they will face a mountain of political crisis. No Jobs, Jobs moving overseas, capital outflow ( America is an extremely capitalistic society ).
It is not uncommon for the people to revolt and overhaul your entire political system, more so in USA since everyone can have a gun.

7. Pride and Dignity of the Citizens. It is a very tough reality when you are being told that you are the No.1 Military and No.1 Economical powerhouse in the world from young and it sound like it will last forever and to lose out to the Chinese ( Squinty Eyed Pig Tails ).

8. Adding a last point here, Chinese corporate threaten the existence of American Corporate. Personal opinion , you can disagree on this. The banning of Huawei and Tiktok has got nothing to do with spyware , spying or poisoning of American Youth. Tik Tok threatens the Social Media market in the USA.
And further more social media is being run on algorithms. They didn't regulate Tik Tok like how they do it in China. They just allowed it to run freely since it is a Free Country.

Tik Tok Statistics
U.S. Audience – As we mentioned, we estimate that TikTok has about 80 million monthly active users in the United States. 60% are female, 40% are male. 60% are between the ages of 16-24. 26% are between the ages 25-44

USA Population : 331.9 million (2021)

I hope I make some sense , I might not. But I am still gathering my thoughts.
One of the best counter that the United States or the West have at the moment is Freedom, Human Rights , an open society where ideals can be shared freely and you can speak freely which is the main attraction..
That being said, the bold above are currently being taken away bit by bit in the West by political fractions and tribalism.

This post was edited by Hamsterbaby on Mar 10 2023 07:11am

On the position of Poland (and demands along those lines) the US and the west could and should never agree. We had this conversation about 3-4 months ago afaik. some of the demands were reasonable, some where not.

and Hamster, well said.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 10 2023 06:58am

New data points to Ukraine destroying nord stream.
Ukraine in war with Russia deliberately pulls whole europe to crisis and no1 cares

I highly doubt it. I think they are being thrown under the bus.

thinks that this might end earliest in 2025. I think it might be even sooner.
We need to look at America's statement towards the Ukrainians these coming months.

The Data in regards to Ukraine destroying Nord Stream is just a start. I read it on New York Times.