Quote (Bananii @ 21 Mar 2022 13:21)
when americans call other countrys scum 😂
I'm not even an American, lol...
Quote (ferdia @ 21 Mar 2022 13:32)
thats the same thing as saying americans, irish, germans, isarael's, australians, chinese, russians are the scum of the earth. The Badge "scum" is not owned by a people or race, its universal and at the same time, specific to an individual. which is why care needs to be taken when labeling people anything other then "people".
No no, you heard me right. Yes, this is a prejuidiced and deeply racist point of view and I fully stand by it: Chechens are, by and large, scum. If more of you guys had personally interacted with these people, you would understand where I'm coming from.
Quote (ofthevoid @ 21 Mar 2022 13:38)
I'm not sure how much control Zelensky actually has over the military, I'd wager very little. He's more of a poster child for the resistance. He has done an excellent job of appealing to literally anyone that would listen internationally.
Not sure how many Ukrainian troops there are in Mariupol but we know that there are at least a few thousand of nazi battalion people there. I'm not sure the passage to leave was really extended to some of these people, hence they probably think it's either we fight until we die or get rounded up by the Russians and Chechens to get disappeared.
edit: I think it's also pretty clear that Mariupol will be one of the cities capitulated to the breakaway regions. So if that's the case, from an Ukrainian perspective, who cares if its turned to rubble.
That's a really good point: it is in the interest of the Ukrainian high command to force the Russians to flatten those cities that will end up going to them in a peace treaty. And since surrendering most likely means death for the members of the Azov Battalion, they will keep fighting until the bitter end.
Quote (Lebanon961 @ 21 Mar 2022 13:59)
You are comparing war with peacetime? What you said that things will be worse for Ukraine in the future if Russia succeeds in it's goals than they were from 1991-2014 is just an assertion of yours. Its fine if that is your opinion but don't present it as fact :)
It's the only logical conclusion. Allowing Ukraine to kinda do its own thing while only buying off a few corrupt decision makers at the top who keep the country inside the Russian influence sphere is the tactic they tried from 1991 to 2014. From the Russian pov, it was an abject failure, so what are they gonna do next time, after waging a brutal war to force Ukraine back under their heel? Would they try a milder, more lenient approach, or would they tighten the reins this time around?
It's also basically a fact that the censorship and crackdown on civic society would be at least as hard in a Russian-occupied Ukraine as in Russia itself.
Quote
My point is that the picture of defiant Ukrainians against Russia isn't some intrinsic attribute of Ukraine but rather a product of the information war which is part of this proxy conflict. We can look at indicators sure - IMO the numbers show a HUGE flight from Kiev, capital cities with millions of populatons don't go empty just like that no matter the public mood - but we can not know the accurate reality.
Well, the numbers I cited imply that some 900k people did in fact flee Kyiv. But those were mostly women and children, for whom fleeing is the smart thing to do and who'd just be a liability during a siege anyway.
This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Mar 21 2022 07:22am