yes, its very nice to have a draft and obliterate the trade of another country until they hit back

without going into actual conspiracy stuff and i am not against having a draft, but its perfectly clear that the US government accepted clear escalation risks, when the general public had no interest in going to war

just be like switzerland and everything is cool

Things coming out of Hungary to me are increasingly interesting right now. In the last couple of days two fairly 'big' things happened.

1st Ukraine is targeting Hungarian majority ethnic towns in Ukraine by removing Hungarian flags particularly around Mukachevo. The Hungarians are clearly annoyed by this and have been vocal about it.

2nd thing is the below that i'm not seeing a lot of msm talking about



https://dailynewshungary.com/hundreds-of-high-ranking-military-officers-sacked-in-hungary/

So it's clear now: Germany allows others countries for training and export of leopard tanks.




Very recent poll show Hungary is an exception with "only" 37% supporting ukraine.
Still 59% of Hungarians are for: "must support sovereign countries when they are attacked by other countries "

https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2023-01/Global%20Advisor%20-%20War%20in%20Ukraine%20-%20Jan%202023%20.pdf

Basically people want to support Ukraine but dont want war at their own door...

This post was edited by Meanwhile on Jan 22 2023 07:08pm

Good news

Germany not sent Leopard 2 tanks to Ukraine.
Finaly some western leaders that activate 1 braincell

Wrong wording, Germany''s foreign minister, the quota woman without brains, Baerbock, said they'd consider any proposal for delivery if such request is submitted by countries willing to ship their leopards to Ukraine. Poland is in an election compaign right now. It's popular for them to scapegoat Germany in any way. Long story short, Poland won't submit anything for approval in the first place => no leopards for Ukraine.
Ultimately, only Scholz himself can allow anything. The others don't have a say.

This post was edited by babun1024 on Jan 23 2023 01:56am

Pathetic ad hominem.

Do you also believe in the right to self-determination of the Ukrainian people, which would be violated if Ukraine just rolled over and became a Russian satellite again like you (seemingly) prefer?
Also, why are you so outraged about forced drafts by Ukraine, but not saying a word about the forced drafts which occurred in Russia a couple of months ago? Do you seriously believe Russia is treating deserters any less harshly?






Everything would have been cool in the short run, except for these annoying pictures of Russian tanks rolling through Kyiv, but we can just turn off the TV, right? In the medium-term, the West leaving Russia's invasion unanswered would have had disastrous repercussions though. It would have been yet another signal of weakness (after the disastrous Afghanistan withdrawal).

So if Ukraine had worked so fine for Putin, chances are that he would try to repeat the same playbook in the Baltics a couple of years later. And that time, the credibility of NATO would have been on the line. Likewise, such a display of weakness and cowardice or selfishness would have emboldened Xi to accelerate the invasion of Taiwan. And unlike with the Russian energy supplies, there would not have been a straight-forward way to substitute the Taiwanese microchips.

Now, I definitely agree that we did not need to go as far as we have in our support of Ukraine/punishment of Russia, but still... doing absolutely nothing in response to an outright invasion of a country in our immediate neighborhood would have been short-sighted.







The pressure on Scholz is increasing by the day though, not just from our NATO partners but also domestically. Even his coaliton partners are becoming increasingly outspoken against Scholz's position. His party's whip (strongest proponent of appeasement) is engaged in an ongoing public feud with the chairwoman of the Defense committee of the German parliament (she's the warmonger-in-chief, basically the German equivalent to McCain).

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jan 23 2023 03:14am

In my opinion, Scholz is defending German interests. Tanks aren't defensive weapons, panzerfausts are. What do we deliver afterwards? Airplanes and troops? How about a full blown WW3? I get the feeling all of our MSM, greens and FDP are on American billionaire's payroll. No one mentions any investigation about the blown up nordstream pipelines anymore. They can all go f themselves for all I care. Putting artificial pressure on Scholz won't work by the way. He could go for vote of no confidence then all of the Labbertasche parties would get shafted by the population. German people are mostly behind Scholz' decision. No faked poll is going to change my opinion.

This post was edited by babun1024 on Jan 23 2023 03:34am

do you think donbas and crimea are rightfully russia's?

i mean, it's pretty obvious you aren't a serious person, just looking at how you outright reject any poll that disagrees with your personal opinion but still, do those regions now belong to russia in your opinion?

a brief comment on tanks : Last week, the Kremlin's spokesman said Western countries supplying additional tanks to Ukraine would not change the course of the conflict, but would add to the problems of the Ukrainian people.

i.e. it suggests this is not a red flag to russia. im sure there was alot of round the table discussions in the west re: will this provoke a reaction from russia or not, before this statement was issued by russia.

in this regard russia is trying to be predictable i guess. i.e. "we dont want ww3 either".



i am pretty much aligned with this.

This post was edited by ferdia on Jan 23 2023 04:05am

Polls on MSM are meant to direct public opinion so your politicians can do shit with "people" behind their decisions. Common sense and more sources to compare are better advisors.
About Russia's aggression. The thing wrong with people like you is you try to divide by going to extremes. You're a typical drone of MSM powered brainwashing. You should ask yourself questions first and use your own brain before consuming information. The answer isn't good or bad or black and white. There're facets. I'll answer your question how a normal person from Germany, mainland Europe, would answer.

Does Donbas and Crimea rightfully belong to Russia? Of course not! Russia hasn't lost anything there.
The question you should ask yourself then which I am sure you don't. Why is Russia so stuck up about Crimea? Maybe, it's their sole access to the sea there? Maybe, they don't want to give up their naval bases? What would the US do, should they be forced to abandon their bases around the world?
We, as Germans, aren't the instigator of the conflict nor a conflict party. The conflict is between geostrategical idiots from the US, Russia and puppets in Ukraine (former and current ones). We are being pulled into that conflict with bogus arguments like Ukraine is fighting for our freedom or Russia is going to be at Berlin's door next. Russia has got 0, absolutely 0 chance of fighting NATO forces! Not a chance! Ukraine isn't in NATO!

The war shouldn't have started in the first place if the Americans weren't the dumbasses to push the pressure button to the maximum without any readiness for talks about Ukraine's Nato aspiration with Russia. Now, that it started, we can't ignore. We have to let Russia bleed as much as possible for that reason we cooperate with Washington and our allies to support Ukraine in its quest to make Russia as weak as possible in the future. What are Moskow's red lines though? I am pretty sure, Moskow only cares about Crimea and how the base can be supplied over Donbas mainland. Giving Ukraine a chance to attack/retake Crimea (which was, is and always has been the reason/interest of US in Ukraine) would give Russia the reason to start a full blown conflict. Crimea itself is of no high interest to Ukrainian mainland population. It's the US that wants Russia gone from there. That's why peace talks are going to be impossible until the US decides to give up Crimea.

The full answer is Crimea and Donbass don't belong to Russia at all but I wouldn't risk a nuclear war on the continent I live over a small island.