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#17801
Nov 25 2022 06:22pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 24 2022 07:11am)
Yes, that's indeed interesting. My guess would be that Kyiv has almost twice the population of Kharkiv and that supplying this many people with diesel generators and drinking water from trucks is logistically impossible while it might still be (barely) feasible for a city of Kharkiv's size.

Also, Kharkiv is located in a much more strategic position, Ukraine cannot possibly give it up. Kharkiv is the base and tent pole for all their operations in the east.


I've been thinking about it for a while and I really can't come to a conclusion. There is a total of 4 things going on that I can't really interpret. I have some speculation, similar to yours but could it be that Russians are gonna attack in kiev? and/or Zaporizhia?

1. Ukrainian side talks about evacuating Kiev, but not places that are worse off like Kharkov
2. Russians are creating strong defensive lines around Belgorod all the way to Kursk
3. There are lines around Donetsk being built
4. There are lines around Crimea being built
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#17802
Nov 25 2022 06:24pm
Quote (Vastet @ Nov 26 2022 03:16am)
People die in war. It sucks that innocent civilians have to suffer for the egos of the rich and powerful. But there has never been a war where civilians didn't suffer. That argument is irrelevant.


Everyone in war is a civilian by the way, mobilized soldiers are just young civilian men forced to fight.. Id rather have 1000 old men and women die than 1 young man or woman.

This post was edited by ownyaah on Nov 25 2022 06:24pm
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#17803
Nov 25 2022 06:25pm
Quote (ownyaah @ 25 Nov 2022 19:24)
Everyone in war is a civilian by the way, mobilized soldiers are just young civilian men forced to fight..


THAT is a giant argument waiting to happen which I'm not currently in the mood for.
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#17804
Nov 25 2022 06:25pm
Quote (Vastet @ Nov 26 2022 03:25am)
THAT is a giant argument waiting to happen which I'm not currently in the mood for.


Yea, i don't like morally driven discussions either. But the open disregard for young men is a bit strange
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#17805
Nov 25 2022 06:25pm
Quote (Vastet @ Nov 25 2022 07:22pm)
Not when you factor in that every Russian escalation has been a direct response to NATO interference.



You’re right in saying that bombing innocent civilians opposed to joining Russia by force as a response to NATO interference (none of which was direct combat) is escalation. I just don’t think that it’s justified.

This post was edited by Chainsaw47 on Nov 25 2022 06:27pm
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#17806
Nov 25 2022 06:27pm
Quote (Chainsaw47 @ 25 Nov 2022 19:25)
You’re right in saying that bombing innocent civilians opposed to joining Russia by force as a response to NATO interference (none of which was direct combat) is escalation. I just don’t think that its justified.


I don't think NATO interference is justified. None of this would be happening if Ukraine had just been left to it's own devices.
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#17807
Nov 25 2022 06:30pm
Quote (Chainsaw47 @ Nov 26 2022 03:25am)
You’re right in saying that bombing innocent civilians opposed to joining Russia by force as a response to NATO interference (none of which was direct combat) is escalation. I just don’t think that it’s justified.


Donetsk bombed 8 years straight, Ukrainians and Russians are guilty of the same thing you are talking about

Quote (Vastet @ Nov 26 2022 03:27am)
I don't think NATO interference is justified. None of this would be happening if Ukraine had just been left to it's own devices.


Ukraine has been under influence of Russians/West since 1991. At times being PRO-Russia and other times Pro-West. This conflict was going to happen regardless, the real cause of the conflict is Lenin 1922 and 1953 Nikita. The power struggle stems directly from policies made at that time.

This post was edited by ownyaah on Nov 25 2022 06:33pm
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#17808
Nov 25 2022 06:33pm
Quote (Vastet @ Nov 25 2022 07:27pm)
I don't think NATO interference is justified. None of this would be happening if Ukraine had just been left to it's own devices.



I don’t think NATO interference is justified either, however it doesn’t make the invasion and the war crimes acceptable. Maybe it makes them more palatable to you to somehow justify the war…
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#17809
Nov 25 2022 06:46pm
Quote (Chainsaw47 @ 25 Nov 2022 19:33)
I don’t think NATO interference is justified either, however it doesn’t make the invasion and the war crimes acceptable. Maybe it makes them more palatable to you to somehow justify the war…


War crimes happen in every war. Again, why is Ukraine more important than everywhere else? You're going to have a very hard time trying to convince me that the US can do whatever it wants and everyone should bow down. It doesn't work that way.
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#17810
Nov 25 2022 06:47pm
Quote (Vastet @ Nov 25 2022 07:46pm)
War crimes happen in every war. Again, why is Ukraine more important than everywhere else? You're going to have a very hard time trying to convince me that the US can do whatever it wants and everyone should bow down. It doesn't work that way.


Cool, but I never claimed that.
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