there was an investigation into biden by the ukraine?

Ukraine isn't up for impeachment, not does anything in my post suggest they did or didnt do an investigation.

im going to +1 with thor here. you got stuck on a word, argued against the dictionary, and are now struggling to articulate a rather pointless semantic gripe.

at this point i dont even trust that you believe your own words. i think you got caught, then disproved by the dictionary, and are now just incapable of saying you were wrong. which is honestly silly, because conceding that he is an opponent doesnt have anything to do with whether or not he should have been impeached. the aid was still sent without an investigation. so Biden being a political opponent, or not, doesnt matter. you're just stuck on it and quadrupling down. its a bit silly to read tbh. and regressive to actual conversation about the impeachment, as ive said maybe 6 times now, its needlessly semantic.

Whether he got his way or not is irrelevant. He asked for the investigation of a political opponent and froze funds to get it, and only unfroze the funds when an investigation into his actions started and it was making headlines that he was abusing his position. Abuse of power is still abuse whether you get your way or not.

then if there was true abuse of power, which i don't see, he will be convicted by the senate. if this turns out to be a purely partisan matter, as it indeed looks like, that's how it will go

nothing requires us to agree on these details, or even respect each other at all

It's the explanation that makes the most sense... the next best one is incompetence from everyone and misreading Trump's directions, but that doesn't pass the smell test for a number of reasons.

We already know what happened.... no point in dragging this out. Mulvaney will just come in and either refuse to talk, or lie. Bolton will confirm what we've already heard. Pompeo will confirm a lot of what we've heard and lie or be less than candid. Nothing they say will change the minds of Republican politicians or voters.

The house impeaching him and the senate exonerating him can both be partisan matters.

that's just a simple false binary, not all abuses of power are or should be impeachable offenses. and not all impeachable offenses are good ideas to impeach over, because of political implications, such as this one. Nanci and co shouldnt have voted, knowing it would fail in senate, as ive said all along.

in my understanding the senate trial is an actual trial setting with a judge presiding

it seems to me to be the best chance to get a fair and even take on the events

yes they can and likely would acquit along partisan lines. unless they nail him on something truly egregious. which i've been waiting for since 2015

Perhaps a flow chart will reveal all the possible outcomes, I believe this is much easier to read. We're just waiting on the Senate to begin a trial right?

Its not a complicated process to begin with, but yes we are waiting for a senate trial and beford that we need courts to decide if trump isballowed to order witnesses not to testify.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Dec 27 2019 04:15pm

currently a slight blockage in that flow heh

hope it gets cleared up soon