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Nov 14 2022 03:11pm
Quote (DizzyBusiness @ Nov 14 2022 08:48pm)
Mostly just been rich countries dropping bombs on poor people since then, or destroying their economies/inciting revolutions to ensure the rich countries continued global dominance. I guess that's cool though, depending where you live, thus me thinking "global" was a reach.


None of what you just mentioned equates to global instability.

I don't disagree that there are atrocities and by no means is the current world order perfect. It has however, prevented an apocalyptic nuclear war or global conflict like WW1 or WW2.
There is always going to be a dominant power. Since 1945 it has been the US and its allies.

By all means suggest another power structure, but be grateful the majority of people aren't already vapourised.

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Nov 14 2022 03:18pm
Quote (DizzyBusiness @ Nov 14 2022 04:06pm)
"The documents show that Zelensky and his partners in a television production company, Kvartal 95, set up a network of offshore firms dating back to at least 2012, the year the company began making regular content for TV stations owned by Ihor Kolomoisky, an oligarch dogged by allegations of multi-billion-dollar fraud. The offshores were also used by Zelensky associates to purchase and own three prime properties in the center of London.

The documents also show that just before he was elected, he gifted his stake in a key offshore company, the British Virgin Islands-registered Maltex Multicapital Corp., to his business partner — soon to be his top presidential aide. And in spite of giving up his shares, the documents show that an arrangement was soon made that would allow the offshore to keep paying dividends to a company that now belongs to his wife."

Maybe this sort of stuff is regular business in Ukraine but it looks sketchy to me.

Why did he start the offshore firms the year he started working for a notorious oligarch? Why switch the ownership of them before he was elected?

I dont think anyone would be shocked he was worth millions as a celebrity, but the way he moved his money and the connections to the oligarch make it seem suspicious.


Don't think you will find a politician/celebrity from Eastern bloc who hasn't meddled in grey zone by moving money through offshores to the west. Its just much smoother process overall than explaining to authorities there that he got say 1 million dollar bonus randomly from a guy who owns the tv network and never officially filed it as a gift so he didn't pay draconian taxes on it. Either way even if all this is true and he cheated the Ukrainian taxsystem of few million dollars, thats nothing compared to past president who has 3-4 yachts and 50 apartments around the world all bought during his tenure as a politician over the course of 20 years, or good ol Vlad who has 100 room mansion with a vip striptease pole dancing room, a special room to hold "mud" for mud baths in and "egg extraction" room near one of 5 kitchens there.

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Nov 14 2022 03:21pm
Quote (Palasan @ Nov 14 2022 04:18pm)
Don't think you will find a politician/celebrity from Eastern bloc who hasn't meddled in grey zone by moving money through offshores to the west. Its just much smoother process overall than explaining to authorities there that he got say 1 million dollar bonus randomly from a guy who owns the tv network and never officially filed it as a gift so he didn't pay draconian taxes on it. Either way even if all this is true and he cheated the Ukrainian taxsystem of few million dollars, thats nothing compared to past president who has 3-4 yachts and 50 apartments around the world all bought during his tenure as a politician over the course of 20 years, or good ol Vlad who has 100 room mansion with a vip striptease pole dancing room, a special room to hold "mud" for mud baths in and "egg extraction" room near one of 5 kitchens there.


I love how people excuses things when it's someone they root for even if it's bad as fuck. Oh it's less than other crooks so we good! Nah it's not good. Stop being a fanboy and wake the fuck up . Can't expect more than a guy who can't be man enough to name his main acc.
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Nov 14 2022 03:21pm
at least the stuff i am paying for seems to work for the ukranians
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Nov 14 2022 03:27pm
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Nov 14 2022 05:11pm)
None of what you just mentioned equates to global instability.

I don't disagree that there are atrocities and by no means is the current world order perfect. It has however, prevented an apocalyptic nuclear war or global conflict like WW1 or WW2.
There is always going to be a dominant power. Since 1945 it has been the US and its allies.

By all means suggest another power structure, but be grateful the majority of people aren't already vapourised.


Is a global conflict the only thing that equates to global instability though? How many countries exactly have to be actively involved in military conflict for it to count as global instability and does economic or social instability factor in at all?

Overall I think western hegemony has been a net good but the last few decades in particular it has become more tyrannical in my opinion, that doesn't mean I yearn for Russian or Chinese dominance but I can criticize what I see as failings on the part of my own society.

I dont know a better structure but from what I see, things are going to change soon regardless of what we want and we can adjust to it or fight it but I think the latter option will lead to untold global suffering.
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Nov 14 2022 03:41pm
Quote (Palasan @ Nov 14 2022 05:18pm)
Don't think you will find a politician/celebrity from Eastern bloc who hasn't meddled in grey zone by moving money through offshores to the west. Its just much smoother process overall than explaining to authorities there that he got say 1 million dollar bonus randomly from a guy who owns the tv network and never officially filed it as a gift so he didn't pay draconian taxes on it. Either way even if all this is true and he cheated the Ukrainian taxsystem of few million dollars, thats nothing compared to past president who has 3-4 yachts and 50 apartments around the world all bought during his tenure as a politician over the course of 20 years, or good ol Vlad who has 100 room mansion with a vip striptease pole dancing room, a special room to hold "mud" for mud baths in and "egg extraction" room near one of 5 kitchens there.


Hard for me to not see it as sketchy, but I agree it's probably hard to find a lot of eastern bloc politicians without something like that going on.

I read alot of money is paid under the table in Ukraine actually, so despite it ranking as quite a poor country the standard of living is higher than you would imagine because people just use cash a lot.
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Nov 14 2022 03:42pm
Quote (SunnyvaleTrailerPark @ Nov 14 2022 04:21pm)
I love how people excuses things when it's someone they root for even if it's bad as fuck. Oh it's less than other crooks so we good! Nah it's not good. Stop being a fanboy and wake the fuck up . Can't expect more than a guy who can't be man enough to name his main acc.


Zelensky has balls of steel, all other old-school Ukrainian politicians left the country prior to the war starting and stayed there first month or two until situation stabilized, some haven't returned at all. Nobody said its good he cheated the tax system, but its an if and theres no concrete proof as of now except for company linked to Zelensky and other individuals moving money from point a to point b and buying property with it in London. Even if we suggest that all that is true:

1) Zelensky has had a legitimate way of earning his money
2) He didn't partake in politics whatsoever thus his hands prior to him becoming President of Ukraine are completely clean on this front.

Now compare it to the alternative

1) Fat old guy who spent 20 years in the Ukrainian politics part of the old guard turn-coat communist party, was an economy minister during the period of time Ukraine's economy was pillaged by Yanukovich and his clan.
2) Has no answer on how he became top 3 richest guy in Ukraine during his rule as president and becoming richer than any other businessman who also produced same product as him ( chocolate ) in entire Europe. (We are talking billions stolen here)
3) Who fled with his entire family to South America and spent 2 months there hiding on his yacht when Russian invasion began, had the audacity to come back despite being a political corpse at that point for PR stunts. Motherfucker just doesn't know when to quit.
4) Who has routinely came up in corruption investigations, schemes etc. And even now constantly lies being recently caught by journalists in London eating out with his family in a restaurant while officially on his social media few hours prior claiming to be in Berlin negotiating weapon shipments for the army.



Who would you rather choose? Sorry there was no Captain America option for the Ukrainians bud.
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Nov 14 2022 03:47pm
Quote (DizzyBusiness @ Nov 14 2022 09:27pm)
Is a global conflict the only thing that equates to global instability though? How many countries exactly have to be actively involved in military conflict for it to count as global instability and does economic or social instability factor in at all?

Overall I think western hegemony has been a net good but the last few decades in particular it has become more tyrannical in my opinion, that doesn't mean I yearn for Russian or Chinese dominance but I can criticize what I see as failings on the part of my own society.

I dont know a better structure but from what I see, things are going to change soon regardless of what we want and we can adjust to it or fight it but I think the latter option will lead to untold global suffering.


Tyrannical perhaps, but paling in comparison to authoritarian regimes like Iran, Russia, North Korea and I would even include China in that list.

What do you see that implies "things will change soon"?
And what changes do you foresee happening?

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Nov 14 2022 04:06pm
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Nov 14 2022 05:47pm)
Tyrannical perhaps, but paling in comparison to authoritarian regimes like Iran, Russia, North Korea and I would even include China in that list.

What do you see that implies "things will change soon"?
And what changes do you foresee happening?


Yeah I agree in that sense, but I think we should still be concerned about the increasingly tyrannical nature of how the west maintains its grip on power.

What makes me think things are changing is the
rising resentment towards western dominance, the current attempt to create another global reserve currency by BRICS, America's internal social and economic issues and the rise of nationalist sentiment in many western countries. I should clarify that by soon I'm thinking more like 20-30 years maybe, not next week.

I'm not sure what the changes will be but I think it could be a complete economic disaster for western countries though of course I hope it isn't. Best case scenario I'd say western countries just have a lot less global influence, as well as the breakdown of a lot of international agreements like NATO and EU, or at least very different than they are today.
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Nov 14 2022 04:06pm
Quote (DizzyBusiness @ Nov 14 2022 04:41pm)
Hard for me to not see it as sketchy, but I agree it's probably hard to find a lot of eastern bloc politicians without something like that going on.

I read alot of money is paid under the table in Ukraine actually, so despite it ranking as quite a poor country the standard of living is higher than you would imagine because people just use cash a lot.


Of course its sketchy, and there are still many issues in Ukraine, outdated built on 1980s Soviet blueprints tax system is one of them, it has largely been a Russian vassal state for 20 odd years dependent on Russian money. But so far Zelensky has been the best president Ukraine ever had even prior to the war breaking out. He had the balls to start harassing and isolating Putins proxies like Medvedevechuk curbing Russian influence and operations in place to overthrow/weaken Ukraine when invasion began to install a puppet president, something super pro-nationalistic Poroshunka never done and constantly played it by the oligarch playbook making deals with said Russian proxies in the Ukraine during his 4 year stint as the president, filling his pockets through retarded see-through projects like building 2 meter fences on the eastern Ukrainian border Russian tanks drove through in seconds when invasion started.



Who in their right mind would build this crap for 100 odd million dollars, using the taxpayers money desperately needed in all other sectors thinking it would provide any sort of protection against Russia?
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