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Nov 8 2022 01:42pm
Quote (Palasan @ Nov 8 2022 08:34pm)
Nice objectivity, suits your addicted to whataboutism self well.


Just tried to be nice, I could've said hi ukrainian multi troll
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Nov 8 2022 01:42pm
Quote (ownyaah @ Nov 8 2022 09:38pm)
So only wars that don't change "international borders" are okay? So you can bomb someone into oblivion, as long as you install a puppet or simply yeet out of there?

Not gonna lie, your logic is pretty flawed.


Thats what Russia planned to do all along is actively doing in all parts of Ukraine it illegally invaded if you haven't noticed.
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Nov 8 2022 01:44pm
Quote (Djunior @ Nov 8 2022 09:42pm)
Just tried to be nice, I could've said hi ukrainian multi troll


Just remove yourself, you are pathetic teen turning debates he knows he cannot win into feces throwing contest "for the luls"
SMH
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Nov 8 2022 01:44pm
Quote (ownyaah @ 8 Nov 2022 20:38)
So only wars that don't change "international borders" are okay? So you can bomb someone into oblivion, as long as you install a puppet?

Not gonna lie, your logic is pretty flawed.


you're strawmanning me, i never said or implied those wars are ok. the only "flaw" here is you trying to justify russia's war by dishonestly pretending i suggested other wars are ok. if you knew anything about me you'd know that i've been one of the harshest critics of american / western imperialism (i know, you don't know imperialism exists, just ignore the term then) - but that does in no way make russia's slaughtering of innocent ukrainians any better. the whole world, INCLUDING russia, agreed to ukraine's borders, including crimea and donbass - so stop pretending russia's invasion is any more justified than mexico attacking the US in order to reclaim previously mexican territory and liberate ethnic mexicans...
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Nov 8 2022 01:50pm
Quote (Palasan @ Nov 8 2022 07:40pm)
China and Russia should never be mentioned in the same sentence to be honest. Its completely different set of ideologies both culturally and historically. Chinese are far too intelligent to pull dumb stunts comparable to what Russia has done. China likes silence, external conflicts are far too loud for its ears.


They are both authoritarian regimes.
The most disappointing thing is the complacency of Russians to allow Putin the type of unquestionable power. Enough people did well enough to not question Stalin 2.0
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Nov 8 2022 01:51pm
Quote (ownyaah @ 9 Nov 2022 03:32)
I personally think that is actually overstated.

The main reason the destruction of Libya happened was because of France. Khaddafi was creating a "united african union", which would be a counter-power to areas that have historically been under French (sphere of power).

A large portion of African security was financed by libya by the way. So after libyas destruction these countries have been ravaged by islamists which in turn has made them fairly unstable.


Agree. Wasn't Sarkozy the one who returned France to NATO full membership in 2009 and lo and behold 2011 came.
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Nov 8 2022 01:52pm
Quote (fender @ Nov 8 2022 03:35pm)
whenever you're confronted with undeniable facts you default to "b-b-but what about x, y, z?!?"
again, two wrongs don't make a right. ukraine is a sovereign nation with internationally recognised borders, which include crimea. that's a FACT. no lazy whataboutism will change that.

the gorbachev agreement is a lie, there is no such thing - as is the alleged donbass genocide. ukraine has every right to fight back russian invaders.

the simple truth is: russia doesn't have ANY better justification to invade ukraine than mexico has to attack the US or mongolia to invade russia. almost every single nation in the world could come up with countless historical grievances against any of its neighbours, but that does NOT legitimise wars to redraw internationally accepted and agreed upon borders.


For anyone interested, you can find the declassified documents on NATO expansion in the national security archive. The documentary "Donbass" is a good look into the situation eastern Ukrainians were experiencing. Graham Phillips is a good resource for information on the current situation in eastern Ukraine as well.
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Nov 8 2022 01:53pm
Quote (Palasan @ Nov 8 2022 08:44pm)
Just remove yourself, you are pathetic teen turning debates he knows he cannot win into feces throwing contest "for the luls"
SMH


I'm here since 2010 unlike you and I never had a multi account.

You're just a dishonest shit multi, you do honest ukrainians no favor, lol

This post was edited by Djunior on Nov 8 2022 01:54pm
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Nov 8 2022 01:54pm
Quote (Djunior @ 8 Nov 2022 20:40)
You're a hypocrite and you've got zero feeling for international politics.

No nuclear power is going to accept this kind of shit happening at their border.

NATO should've realized that and said well fine we had a damn good run and forget about further expansion East.

Simple as that


that narrative has been debunked a million times, you're just not intelligent enough to accept FACTS that don't fit your propaganda narrative.

NATO doesn't actively expand. it doesn't look for nations and invites them to join. it's a defensive military pact, not an economic union. sovereign nations can APPLY to join, and they have to fulfil a whole bunch of criteria in order to do so.

the ukrainian PEOPLE have decided they want to associate with the west. it's their right to do that, they are a sovereign nation. they realised that western democracies provide their people with freedoms and prosperity, opposed to russia's authoritarianism and poverty. history does NOT give russia the right to determine who other nations are allowed to associate with. yes, you can argue that russia thinks that, and i'm sure many in russia genuinely do, but that does not make it a valid argument.
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Nov 8 2022 01:56pm
Quote (Prox1m1ty @ Nov 8 2022 09:50pm)
They are both authoritarian regimes.
The most disappointing thing is the complacency of Russians to allow Putin the type of unquestionable power. Enough people did well enough to not question Stalin 2.0


They are but China is nowhere near as vertical as Russia is. China has answers to what it will be after current leader and next 3 leaders that follow, Russia does not.
Its very true that letting Russia "officially" get away with landgrab will only lead to push the constraints even further as it pours its resources into its military and catches its breath domestically speaking. The rampant corruption doesn't help but the gears are grinding with scapegoats and new appointments every few weeks.
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