our workforce will be provided a stipend via UBI paid for by corporations. once we dont need cheap labor and automation makes products even cheaper than chinese labor produce products we'll sell to you and everyone else and pay our own citizens with your money.

there will be unrest as the population transitions beyond working to live, but millions of your people will starve once they're no longer needed. we'll come out on top by a mile as your countries in asia struggle to steal our automation secrets and figure out how to feed the masses.

Is he being attack for the sheer fact of proposing any sort of peace deal, or is he being attacked for the specifics of his propsal? His suggestion offers Russia far too favorable terms, given the military and moral position they are in right now. Criticizing Musk for that is fully justified and does not make one a "warmonger who categorically rejects a peafecul solution" or something along those lines.

All of that can be solved in short order. Unions don't really matter to U.S. economic imperialism, and basic infrastructure for simple manufacturing is pretty easy.

We don't get incredibly complex products from China. We get cheap shit. That's why Taiwan and South Korea are so much more important. If we were suddenly cut off from those two countries alone our GDP would drop 50% just from the lack of chip manufacturing. It would take 5 years minimum to get back to where we are now.

In other news, the TTF Gas futures, which are the leading indicator for Europe's gas prices, have come down another €20 since the weekend:

https://www.theice.com/products/27996665/Dutch-TTF-Gas-Futures/data?marketId=5439161&span=1

Gas prices are still too high, but the downward trend is encouraging and seems persistent. So it looks, at least for now, as if Russia's gas gambit will turn out to be a failure.

That is why US is forcing SK and Samsung and TSMC to shift their operations to the US, which in turn will sacrifice the Labor force in both countries and it also means you have to produce very technical people in the United States to take over those jobs.
I think you need to research more on Chip manufacturing and it's cost to the environment and the the how much it cost to produce them with regards to it's labor cost.

TSMC could be bullied into moving to USA which means Taiwan will be more or less useless after that and Taiwan will truly be a cannon folder like Ukraine.

SK and Samsung will be quite reluctant to move and they will probably riot and move away from their reliance on the United States.

And you already mentioned that China is good at stealing , didn't you ? You think they haven't stolen the tech and the Know hows in making chips by now? Or maybe they are just keeping quiet about it at the moment.

If they can steal your tech to make a smiliar F 35, stealing Chip tech isn't that hard.
Fair enough , it might be a inferior product at first, but with time it will be just be as good or better.

Just like how the Japanese auto industry wrecked the American auto industry ( Not sure if you know what happen in regards to this particular history ).

Yes, their OWN survival. Rest is moot/cope. Do you see yourself as a leader?



That sounds more like cope tbh. The lullaby of "nothing bad will happen" is always told before shit hits the fan. Take inflation, energy crisis, insolvencies etc. same story as always.

1. No argument in case of a military loss, where govs try to save their asses.
2. See above.
3. True. This is a serious argument. May make the citizens uncomfortable and lead to riots, IF the support stops.
4. False. It would be nato that rsiks a total world nuclear holocaust over a territory grab by russia which isnt even about nato teritory to begin with. Sure they could change the doctrine/agreements of nato and let ukraine join, which would be equal to ww3 start.
5. True -> ww3 start (see Nr. 4)
6. See Nr. 4.

Tbh i dont see a single reason what my country would gain by joining the shitflinging when shits going to become serious.

This post was edited by Impy on Oct 4 2022 01:51pm

Automation secrets are already stolen by the time you mention this.

In regards to masses, the Chinese population are dwindling within the next 30 to 40 years they might probably be 60 to 70% of what it is now.
When a country gets more educated and advance people do not reproduce as often.

Thats what I think. In regards to Automation and UBI, Paul Krugman have written an opinion on this and he have a different viewpoint on UBI.
I am not well read in this particular subject as compared to you but perhaps you can take a look.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/15/opinion/andrew-yang-automation.html

Krugman's op-ed is largely a strawman, aimed at Yang's initial proposal for a 1k$/month payment structure he only forwarded to get attention to UBI and himself as a candidate. Krugman basically multiplies that amount by the # of households and says "we cant afford it". that same logic can be applied to almost any proposal in it's infancy, all politicians promise the world knowing their actual plan is for far less.

UBI once it becomes a thing will be smaller payments and targeted only at those who cannot be reabsorbed by the labor market, at the same time increasing taxes for corporations who automate to pay for it. we're too late for it to be done smoothly, but it has to be done regardless of what people think about UBI and demotivation it may cause in the populace.

as to chinese automation you've lagged FAR behind because of cheap labor. why develop robots to inspect and reject product when u can pay someone to do it?

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 4 2022 02:01pm

The Chinese are doing it exactly right now, but they will take a longer time because they have to first get rid of or phase out those cheap labor jobs.
For a one party totalitarian government, it is quite effective.

Yangs proposal and anyone who wants to try out UBI idea will be met with alot of resistance since that is how American politics works, so it will take some time.

who ever tries it will be met with resistance, until its needed, then whoever against it will be met with resistance. that's a problem, but it will be fine.