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Oct 1 2022 05:10am
Quote (babun1024 @ 1 Oct 2022 09:16)
You spew so much propaganda BS at once. I don't know whether you believe what you say.
1. We didn't ban Ukraine from NATO. Germany, France and Italy did, all founding members of the EU but you guys aim at Germany as scapegoat.
2. There isn't a single pipeline, there are 4. One of them goes through Poland, the other one through Ukraine. We would never need NS1 or NS2 if Poland wouldn't ask for horrendous amounts of transit fee just because the pipelines went through Poland and Ukraine actively stealing, not paying up gas. We were paying for both of you. Stop getting gas and transit fees from Russia. The other argument of fully dependance doesn't work either. If Russia had 0 pipelines leading to Germany and just halted all gas export to whatever nation the price hike would be the same for Europe. We simply don't have enough energy resources of our own.
3. Whoever told you nuclear energy would be cheap, safe or clean is the biggest idiot on earth. The most expensive bit about nuclear energy is its waste which virtually never disappears and is very expensives to keep monitored. Then you have fuckups like Chernobyl and Fukushima which make places inhabitable forever. I don't want such a thing ever in Europe to happen.
4. Gas, specially gas and nothing else is used to create fertilizer on industrial scale. Germany isn't just dependent on gas, we consume as much as 100x of Poland together because Poland is a beggar nation which still reapairs its infrastructure from money given by Germany to EU funds. You're still at net negative. Back to topic, without that fertilizer food prices are going to go up all around the world, billions of hungry people and starvations. The peak is going to be in 2023-24. The rest depends on how long the war is going to continue.
5. We spend more on military than all Poland and baltic states together, it's just less than 2% of our GDP, but our GDP is gigantic in the first place. Again, you've been brainwashed by MSM. While we spend so much in military we also pay for the meat shields Poland and other Baltic states through EU to keep them armed in case of a conflict. Without the EU, the Polish and Baltic card house would crumble in no time. Basically, Germany, France and Italy are NATO's backbone through EU. In case, you didn't know, Russia's number 1 enemy would be Germany.

Back to topic, the truth is truth. I am not putting dirt on anyone when I say it how it is. Sorry, if you're from places where talking the truth is regarded as puting dirt on someone. The last nation to use arms with totsl disregard to civilian casualties on mass scale manner has been USA. Vietnam, Iraq then Syria. You can look yourself for the amount of victims. The biggest fuckups in history which is being interpreted as not so bad in the end written by the books of victors are Hirosgima and Nagasaki. The US is the only country which actually used nukes. When I want to describe what Putin's Russia could do in the future I am forced to look for the US references because there's been no precedence from other countries since WW2.

Mr. birdbrain, Russia would rather nuke Poland and Germany than Ukraine. Use your brain to find out why.


The difference between two of us is that I say constructive things like "Germany is not meeting nato guidelines on Army sending" and you say things like "Poland is a beggar nation".
See the difference?
Just because we dont have as much money as Germany and worldwide leading companies like Volkswagen, bmw, Siemens, doesnt really make us beggars.
Do you want to build and keep European Union or not? What kind of Union would that be if one country calls another beggar? First and secondclass citizens?
Thats not how EU works. Please correct your behaviour and attitiude.
Being in EU, while a great common market, also brings cost to us. When we build new roads, we need to do things like passes for Animals, and when there are frogs we need to move road away. Such environmental rules we wouldnt do on our own as a not rich country.
Rubbish prices have gone up like 20times, as before we just throw them away, and know we have to recycle them, and its costly.
We also had to close many coal mines, because EU doesnt like it, and need to import extremely overpriced coal from outside of EU.
We need to limit co2 emitions, as part of EU. While countries like China or USA say "fuck it".
So I personally consider the cash we get from EU as a help to make up for policies that we wouldnt take, if we were outside of EU, and not beggar stuff.

And about horrendous fees for gas transfer through polish territory, how much it was exactly? I honestly dont know, nobody told me such things before.

US used nukes, but later made Japan people their friends. Nobody forces Japan to be friendly with USA, they could switch to China anytime, but they like USA more, because liberal USA is better than China. First of all if decide to be friends with USA you can get out of friendship anytime. If you decide to hang out with Russia, you cant really tell them to go away.
Do I have to remind you that they occupied part of Germany for 45years? Even built a gigantic wall? While USA/UK/France gave freedom to Western Germany. This is a huge difference.
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Oct 1 2022 05:17am
Quote (Djunior @ 1 Oct 2022 09:26)
WTF lol, promising Ukraine future NATO membership actually caused the problems. I would stop watching MSM news outlets if I were you.


What caused the problems is mr Putin who wants to rebuild USSR or 19th age Russian Empire.
See what he did to Belarus? They lost their independence. Mr Lukashenka stays a president and fakes every elections.
When people protest, Russians come and pacify the protesters. Lukashenka get cheaper resources, payed price in Belarus independence.
Ukraine didnt want to become second Belarus, a defacto Russian vassal/slave country, and this is why Putin attacked.
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Oct 1 2022 05:22am
Quote (Ironfister @ Oct 1 2022 12:10pm)
The difference between two of us is that I say constructive things like "Germany is not meeting nato guidelines on Army sending" and you say things like "Poland is a beggar nation".
See the difference?
Just because we dont have as much money as Germany and worldwide leading companies like Volkswagen, bmw, Siemens, doesnt really make us beggars.
Do you want to build and keep European Union or not? What kind of Union would that be if one country calls another beggar? First and secondclass citizens?
Thats not how EU works. Please correct your behaviour and attitiude.
Being in EU, while a great common market, also brings cost to us. When we build new roads, we need to do things like passes for Animals, and when there are frogs we need to move road away. Such environmental rules we wouldnt do on our own as a not rich country.
Rubbish prices have gone up like 20times, as before we just throw them away, and know we have to recycle them, and its costly.
We also had to close many coal mines, because EU doesnt like it, and need to import extremely overpriced coal from outside of EU.
We need to limit co2 emitions, as part of EU. While countries like China or USA say "fuck it".
So I personally consider the cash we get from EU as a help to make up for policies that we wouldnt take, if we were outside of EU, and not beggar stuff.

And about horrendous fees for gas transfer through polish territory, how much it was exactly? I honestly dont know, nobody told me such things before.

US used nukes, but later made Japan people their friends. Nobody forces Japan to be friendly with USA, they could switch to China anytime, but they like USA more, because liberal USA is better than China. First of all if decide to be friends with USA you can get out of friendship anytime. If you decide to hang out with Russia, you cant really tell them to go away.
Do I have to remind you that they occupied part of Germany for 45years? Even built a gigantic wall? While USA/UK/France gave freedom to Western Germany. This is a huge difference.


this was a good post.

Quote (Ironfister @ Oct 1 2022 12:17pm)
What caused the problems is mr Putin who wants to rebuild USSR or 19th age Russian Empire.
See what he did to Belarus? They lost their independence. Mr Lukashenka stays a president and fakes every elections.
When people protest, Russians come and pacify the protesters. Lukashenka get cheaper resources, payed price in Belarus independence.
Ukraine didnt want to become second Belarus, a defacto Russian vassal/slave country, and this is why Putin attacked.


a minor clarification, Ukraine didnt want to become second Belarus, and took steps to break away entirely from Russia, and this is why Putin attacked.

This post was edited by ferdia on Oct 1 2022 05:23am
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Oct 1 2022 05:30am
Quote (ferdia @ 1 Oct 2022 11:05)
he just does not like germany. its old news.


I like german people, but when there is something I dislike I say that.
The guy said about Italy, i dont expect much suport from Iitaly, as for them Russia is a very far away country. For Italy I imagine the main problems are boats from Africa, than Russia.
But at least Germany should be more consious. Also Germany are somewhat bigger and richer than Italy.
Besides that guy is German, so I was speaking about Germany to him. If he were Italian maybe we talk about Italy. As simple as that.

Quote (Hamsterbaby @ 1 Oct 2022 11:46)
He is a Polish nationalist :P


No Im not, lol. Nationalists, at least in Europe, are either sily 19th century concept or Russia agents who want to break EU and eat them one by one.
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Oct 1 2022 05:34am
Quote (Ironfister @ Oct 1 2022 12:30pm)
I like german people, but when there is something I dislike I say that.
The guy said about Italy, i dont expect much suport from Iitaly, as for them Russia is a very far away country. For Italy I imagine the main problems are boats from Africa, than Russia.
But at least Germany should be more consious. Also Germany are somewhat bigger and richer than Italy.
Besides that guy is German, so I was speaking about Germany to him. If he were Italian maybe we talk about Italy. As simple as that.



No Im not, lol. Nationalists, at least in Europe, are either sily 19th century concept or Russia agents who want to break EU and eat them one by one.


and also ty for this clarification.
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Oct 1 2022 06:00am
Quote (Ironfister @ Oct 1 2022 01:17pm)
What caused the problems is mr Putin who wants to rebuild USSR or 19th age Russian Empire.
See what he did to Belarus? They lost their independence. Mr Lukashenka stays a president and fakes every elections.
When people protest, Russians come and pacify the protesters. Lukashenka get cheaper resources, payed price in Belarus independence.
Ukraine didnt want to become second Belarus, a defacto Russian vassal/slave country, and this is why Putin attacked.


EU and NATO should've kept out of Ukraine. No meddling, no coup, no EU membership, no NATO membership. Plain and simple.

Now you got a major war unfolding, gg
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Oct 1 2022 06:36am
Let's completely forget that part where 2014 gov got thrown away by mercenaries and nazis tho
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Oct 1 2022 06:46am
Quote (Djunior @ Oct 1 2022 01:00pm)
EU and NATO should've kept out of Ukraine. No meddling, no coup, no EU membership, no NATO membership. Plain and simple.

Now you got a major war unfolding, gg


isn't ukraine independent to do whatever it wants to do?

Quote (Melatonina @ Oct 1 2022 01:36pm)
Let's completely forget that part where 2014 gov got thrown away by mercenaries and nazis tho


things that never happened for 200
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Oct 1 2022 06:49am
Quote (Melatonina @ 1 Oct 2022 20:36)
Let's completely forget that part where 2014 gov got thrown away by mercenaries and nazis tho



United States involvement

In December 2013, Republican Senator John McCain in company with Democratic senator Chris Murphy visited Yatsenyuk and Tyahnybok and later addressed the crowds:

Ukraine will make Europe better and Europe will make Ukraine better, we are here to support your just cause, the sovereign right of Ukraine to determine its own destiny freely and independently. And the destiny you seek lies in Europe.

Speaking to CNN on the same day, McCain said:

What we're trying to do is try to bring about a peaceful transition here, that would stop the violence and give the Ukrainian people what they unfortunately have not had, with different revolutions that have taken place – a real society. This is a grassroots revolution here – it's been peaceful except when the government tried to crack down on them, and the government hasn't tried that since. I'm praising their ability and their desire to demonstrate peacefully for change that I think they deserve. [...] These people love the United States of America, they love freedom – and I don't think you could view this as anything other than our traditional support for people who want free and democratic society.[352]

A line of riot police in Kyiv on 12 February.

In a recorded phone conversation leaked on 4 February, Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt are heard discussing their wishes for a Ukraine transition to an interim government, and specifically, the roles in which they hoped to see the prominent opposition leaders:

Nuland: "I don't think Klitsch (Klitschko) should go into the government. I don't think it's necessary, I don't think it's a good idea."

Pyatt: "Just let him stay out and do his political homework and stuff."

Nuland: "I think Yats (Yatsenyuk) is the guy who's got the economic experience the governing experience. I just think Klitsch going in… he's going to be at that level working for Yatseniuk, it's just not going to work. We want to try to get somebody with an international personality to come out here and help to midwife this thing."[353]

Nuland was also recorded in the same conversation saying, "Fuck the EU," dismissively referring to slow-moving European efforts to address political paralysis and a looming fiscal crisis in Ukraine
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Oct 1 2022 06:50am
Quote (SanduLungu @ Oct 1 2022 08:46am)
isn't ukraine independent to do whatever it wants to do?



things that never happened for 200


https://www.google.com/amp/s/moderndiplomacy.eu/2018/06/04/how-and-why-the-u-s-government-perpetrated-the-2014-coup-in-ukraine/amp/
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