Makes sense, thank you.



Would it be reasonable to consider and compare scenarios in which the west's posture (support/funding/sanctions) was different?

My question really is, how many more/fewer people have died due to the west's subsequent aggressions and where do we draw the line to assign the amount of guilt due to Russia's unjustified aggression (invasion).

Why would any industry WANT to migrate east? Russia has been undergoing a serious brain drain for far longer than the Ukrainian crisis.

Turns out, when you stop keeping people inside your borders with thinly veiled threats of violence, they... leave.

That's a possibility, although I think it's very unlikely. Ukraine doing that would be a stab in the back of the allies on whose support their continued existence as a free and independent nation depends. If Ukraine got caught red-handed sabotaging these pipelines, they could basically start building the Putin statues on maidan square...

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Poland & the Baltics makes more sense since they have much less to lose if they take such a risk, but even then, the timing doesn't pan out. It's highly unlikely that public upheaval forces European governments to drop their support for Ukraine altogether and resume trade with Russia as if nothing happened. The governments in France and Germany were elected less than a year ago and don't have to face voters for a long time. And even in Italy, the big winner within the triumphant right-wing alliance was Meloni, who has publicly declared her support for Ukraine and her faithfulness to NATO, while her Russia-friendly partners Salvini and Berlusconi finished below expectations and essentially limp into the forthcoming government.

So all in all, it will take at least 3 months if not more before the (imho very unlikely) scenario of the European public turning fully on this war has any chance of materializing. If Poland & the Baltics wanted to preemptively sabotage a rapprochement with Russia, they should render the Nord Stream pipelines unusable closer to the tipping point, not 3++ months in advance when there's enough time to repair them.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Sep 27 2022 02:09pm

Lol and you're still living in the 1990's on top of everything else

Get. A. Fucking. Grip

China, the biggest market in the world and the most quickly growing middle class in the world.

Obv we talk about Russia in this thread, but there is a simultaneous push by the US to force Europe to decouple from China, including a pretty similar playbook to Ukraine through the destruction of the One China Policy and forcing a new and final Taiwan crisis.

Bom bom bom BOM

This chart is confusing me tbh. The USA and the Western European countries have high levels of net immigration, i.e. higher numbers of immigration than emigration, but the chart shows it the other way round. And what is "citation class" supposed to mean? Are they talking about education level? Also, the chart doesn't include Russia at all, so how is it a counter to his argument? Don't get me wrong, you're absolutely in the right here, but unless I'm missing something, this chart does nothing to support your point.

Even large US firms are investing heavily in China. General Motors (specifically Buick) and Apple being notable there. But China isn't experiencing the problems Russia is.

Russia's population has fallen by 3 million over the last 33 years. China's has risen like 270 million. People (especially the best and brightest) have been fleeing Russia since the collapse of the USSR. The USA doesn't need to conspire against Russia.



These are net migration numbers and destinations FOR RUSSIA.

This post was edited by Santara on Sep 27 2022 02:53pm

Oooh, that makes sense then, lol. You should have mentioned that right away though