Unsophisticated math there tho. They're up there in spending but modernization money didn't get spent in what it was supposed to.

Where are the T80s? Why aren't they mass produced yet? Fucking T72s? Lol. Where is the air force? Absent to the point there can be armor engagements.

Russia has a large military and they're deployed all over the place not just Ukraine. Ukraine has its entire military at home, is fighting at home, are much more mitigated, and have the support of most democratic nations.

Even if Kyiv falls it will be a Pyrrhic victory.

This post was edited by Skinned on Mar 8 2022 07:04am

yes ok i can defer to you on this.



apologies for shortening the quote, just trying to be concise - yes unsophisticated but you get the general gist, and see my response to the above.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 8 2022 07:10am

Well that is Russian main official narrative its selling to its citizens, liberation of Ukrainians from nazis who have taken control here to do historically brotherly Ukrainians justice, liberate them and return them into Russian sphere of influence as Ukrainians are - quoting Putin himself
"One Nation with Russia". So official narrative is almost identical to that of Hitlers narrative to invade Sudetenland.

"German nationalistic sentiment among the German-speaking peoples of Czechoslovakia, and started a massive propaganda campaign which aimed to show that the German minority was being repressed by the predominantly Czech government. Feigning outrage over the supposed mistreatment of German peoples inside the borders of his southern neighbor, in September 1938 Hitler demanded that Czechoslovakia cede the Sudetenland to Germany or be prepared to face war.:

Putin is doing exactly the same, propaganda campaign -> invasion -> trying to force Ukraine into officially giving up Crimea, DNR and LNR on pretext of Ukrainian "nazis" mistreating ethnic Russkies here.

Theory =/= reality.
Russia has numbers, but in conventional warfare its tactics are the same as they where back in 1940s -> use raw numbers as cannon fodder -> drown its opponent in corpses. That only worked well when Russia was defending, and won't work in offensive scenario.

Look here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_military_expenditure_by_country#2010%E2%80%932019

India is coming from a lower base level and has only started spending more on its military than Russia very recently, so they should still be slightly behind them in overall power. France and the UK spend somewhat less than Russia on paper, but their militaries are much more modern and well-trained; their spending suffers from significantly less waste to corruption than Russia's. It's probably really close between these 4.

The latest (america) theory crafted outcomes are:

1. a long drawn out war (years)
2. the splitting of ukraine (months)
3. Insurgency ala Northern Ireland (years)
4. Russia win, new cold war (decades)
5. Russia retreats, no hard feelings (months)

I dont see #5 happening any time soon, and well im surprised they have not theory crafted a possibility of an escalation of war, with Nato. i.e. #6 Russia invades Poland and WW3. I mean they ignore Russia's red lines, so in theory Russia might match some of the west's tendancies to ignore red lines.



before I read that link, everything you just posted is logical and i agree, but i will go read that now.

/edit on review - China and South Korea as well. I understand both of those. not worried about South Korea (defensive to my mind) but you can bet your bippee that Taiwan is worried about that Chinese growth spurt.

This post was edited by ferdia on Mar 8 2022 07:24am

but wouldnt a nation as big as india build their own stuff? its pretty common in the arms industry to give out a license to another country to build a product

according to wiki the t90 tank for example for the indian army is also built in india itself

Zelensky: "Regarding NATO, I lost interest in this issue after we realized that NATO is not ready to accept Ukraine. The alliance is afraid of contradictory things and confrontation with the Russian Federation."

NATO is shit, yet...

LMFAO, I'm being lectured by a Putin sock puppet about knowing what I'm talking about.

NATO is already on Russia's border.

Being nuclear powers didn't stop each other from engaging in proxy warfare. As a matter of fact, proxy warfare between great powers is better than direct warfare.

Russia isn't defending itself from a nuclear power, it is attacking a country that gave up its nuclear weapons in exchange for security assurances.

This post was edited by Santara on Mar 8 2022 07:34am

People fail to realize that Russia does not have years nor will be able to maintain this invasion for more than 1-2 months maximum.