The more they try and fail the sadder I feel for them, not for some lives that didn't exist. I don't know why you'd even make it about the embryo's that are being lost when the actual human being that has a mind rights and feelings is probably on an emotional roller coaster of hope and pain while trying to get a pregnancy to stick.

It's on a similar tier to getting upset about people wasting sperm by masturbating, "how many dead sperm is too many?"

Intent.

well I think that every child should have a chance at life...

but then again I do think women should have a say...

the core of the pro life argument is that an embryo = a life. so there's that.

i mean i agree with you, i tend to think more about the terrible toll that would take on someone. just as i think about the toll it takes on a raped woman to give birth. i personally believe a life starts after birth, or in reality somewhere in the 2nd or 3rd trimester when cognizance is there. the issue is that's not objective, its different whether a minute or a month with every child. but overall i'm pro choice for 1st trimester pregnancies only without some other health related factor.



negligence can take the place of intent in many moral and legal situations

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 4 2017 06:40pm

the most objective way I can look at it is, if it were delivered at this moment, would it survive? If yes then it has a life of its own and abortion shouldn't be permitted at that point.

well survival of premies is pretty unknown until a few weeks or months go by. that is hard if not impossible to even say in womb. i agree with your general sentiment, although i wouldn't measure survival i'd measure awareness.

He asked if it made the woman a murderer. Murder is an intentional action to maliciously bring about the end of another's life.

If you negligently hit someone with your car, you are guilty of a negligent vehicular homicide, but that's not equivalent to murder.

/e: I'm not saying that I would call the woman who got an abortion a murderer though. I was merely responding to OP's inane question.

This post was edited by timmayX on Oct 4 2017 06:48pm

How do you measure the awareness of an embryo/fetus?

This post was edited by DCSS on Oct 4 2017 06:45pm

You're asking why I have a personal opposition to abortion? I find it a very unfortunate occurrence for all involved, and think that if we corrected some of the more problematic aspects of what we do on this and related issues (Republican TRAP laws and their other anti-abortion measures, expanding Medicaid and family assistance programs) that many would be unnecessary.

i could bore you with many semantics arguments about the definition of murder, how it changes regionally, etc. but that's pretty pointless.

the OP phrased her question awfully, the lack of nuanced conversation afterwards is mostly her fault but the topic could have had potential given the topical story i posted. i just got hung up on murder, which i read as a label for effect by the OP. she just aimed too high.

it's an interesting conversation, if someone has dire fertility issues how long should they be allowed to fertilize and subsequently kill embryos? what if each pregnancy makes it to the 3rd trimester?



currently we cant

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 4 2017 06:49pm