good post,

npr is bias fake news

I was looking up an Orwell quote and came across an interesting quote of Jefferson Davis:

“The North was mad and blind: it would not let us govern ourselves, and so the war came. And now it must go on till the last man of this generation falls in his tracks, and his children seize the musket and fight our battle, unless you acknowledge or right to self government. We are not fighting for slavery. We are fighting for independence, and that, or extermination.”

also:

“Every man should endeavor to understand the meaning of subjugation before it is too late… It means the history of this heroic struggle will be written by the enemy; that our youth will be trained by Northern schoolteachers; will learn from Northern school books their version of the war; will be impressed by the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors, and our maimed veterans as fit objects for derision… It is said slavery is all we are fighting for, and if we give it up we give up all. Even if this were true, which we deny, slavery is not all our enemies are fighting for. It is merely the pretense to establish sectional superiority and a more centralized form of government, and to deprive us of our rights and liberties.”
– Confederate Major General Patrick R. Cleburne







Secession and self government aren't traitorous acts and the Confederate states weren't the aggressors.
Read more about Fort Sumter, particularly its reinforcement in contravention of agreements with the South.


If a state seceded now would that be an act of treachery? Of course not.
It is supposed to be a voluntary union of states, not permanent and unconditional servitude.

This post was edited by cambovenzi on Jun 10 2020 08:40pm

Honestly NPR should be defunded, every time i listen to them on the radio they sound like a liberal mouthpiece.

At the very least they need a sort of political spectrum editorial panel. You can’t be funded by all Americans but be the mouthpiece for only one political side.

Enthusiastically Agreed. State funded lefty propaganda masquerading as neutral. No way in hell we should be forced to pay for that.

The southern states made several aggressive moves, including raiding federal armories, attacking strategic points held by the union, and raising their own army well before Fort Sumter.

Not to mention it was a stupid rebellion. The fictional equivalent would be the Greyjoy rebellion in A Song of Ice and Fire.

The entire thing was about slavery, and you can read about it here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_States_Constitution

I am glad that the USSR and the United States weren't ruthless in liberating Germany. I am not glad that the Union, specifically Sherman, spared so many Confederate soldiers' lives.

"They South will never forget!"
"Good. Let them remember what happens when they march on the North."

Raising an army isn't an act of aggression.

Yes there were points of conflict prior to Fort Sumter, centering around union forts in confederate states, but there was a tentative peace.




A toddler's understanding of history

Says it right in the Confederate Constitution. You could boil it down to: it was about states' rights.

But states' rights about what, exactly? Slavery. The plantation class had a vested interest in keeping things the way they were. The problem was the slaves were freed in a way that still kept them chained up.

It's actually not a toddler's understanding. It's enshrined in most state's decree of secession and the writings of the founders of the confederacy. More or less every historical scholar agrees as well. The idea that it wasn't about slavery originated after the southerners needed to come up with a better reason. It was retroactive and can largely be traced to specific organizations trying to rewrite history, like the daughters of the confederacy. In actuality there is no real debate on why they seceded outside of people who are just kind of ignorant of the history.

There were "points of conflict" directly ordered by the governors of seceding states on armories and locations in states that had not seceded. When you take the fact that they were ordering attacks on union forts and armories, then issued an order to raise an army... what was the north supposed to think exactly? "Oh, they're just attacking us and raising an army to play nice."



The right to own slaves, and the right to force other states to return escaped slaves, and the right to expand slavery.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Jun 10 2020 09:49pm

100% correct.