A lot of this is actually pretty true tbh.

"yeah a lot of people are saying we're throwing the Kurds to Erdogan"

"yeah totally man, its amazing seeing the effect Trump has had on these people"

(proceeds to talk about Trump Derangement Syndrome)

par for the course, haven't heard any libertarian with the balls to actually address the topic of the Kurds in earnest. just TDS as the answer. feel free to prove me wrong tho Cam.

Amazing how you managed to listen to a 23 minute interview in less than 15 minutes.

Trying to dumb down a very interesting and varied interview about war as 'yeah man, TDS' isn't going to cut it.

You managed to dishonestly clip one statement out of a list and its broader context and pretend they are invalidly talking about TDS out of left field and dodging the real issue.
the kurds aren't the real issue.

As much as you'd like to sweep TDS. the deep state, and pervasive warmongering under the rug and talk about transgender bathrooms, not everyone is so willing to do so.
Not every interview or statement has to be about what you want them to talk about.

The sweeping leftist (and MSM) condemnation of Trump withdrawing troops when they are ostensibly anti-war is fascinating and deserves analysis and commentary.
(even if you dont like people recognizing the dangerous 'anti-trump no matter where that puts us on the issues' attitude)

As to the kurds:
Do you think democrats gave a flying fuck about the kurds a week ago? Thats not the real reason they are opposing trump on this.
Should US troops risk their lives or stay over there forever to try to save the kurds from another NATO member? Or is that not the primary goal of the US Armed Forces and the US government?

how many strawman's can you fit into one post? perhaps leaving pard has left you more rusty than a Model T.

1. I didnt say in my post i listened to the entire video
2. i didnt try to dumb anything down, did not claim the entire video was a TDS circlejerk
3. i didn't dishonestly clip a single statement, i simply pointed out that when the host mentioned the Kurds Smith didn't even acknowlege he said it, and in the following minute or two didnt mention the kurds, only TDS.
4. i find TDS, the Deep state, and war mongering (especially) to all be worthwhile subjects.
5. i argued a seperate libertarian justification for not passing the bathroom laws, you disagreed, and are still butthurt clearly.
6. i took Fender to task yesterday about his TDS and general inability to do anything but give NPC answers

now that im past the bullshit strawmans out of left fucking field let's move on to the actual context, even though it's still a bullshit strawman:



1. no the dems dont give a fuck
2. i know it's not the real reason, and TDS is in play, that doesn't excuse dodging the Kurdish issue altogether
3. the death counts in Syria are tiny compared to the Iraq or Afghanistan wars, as is the cost, as is the size force staying there. all important context
4. Turkey shouldn't be in NATO, and NATO shouldn't exist. it's a relevant point you're making but doesn't affect my stance personally.

I think personally the Kurds deserve a new Israel, hopefully somewhere far as fuck away from Muslims. we did it for Ze Jews, we did it for the Hmong, it's time for the Kurds. they're unwelcome anywhere they are and anywhere they can conceivably make it to. plenty of Muslim free cheap af real estate in Estonia, and buying it would be cheaper than defending the Kurds for another 20 years.

I hope you're having a happy holidays tho Cam.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Dec 21 2018 02:39pm

'every statement and question and allusion to fact i don't like is a strawman'
yikes.

Making a sardonic joke about you not watching the whole video isn't me claiming that you said you watched the whole thing. thats not how this works.
Its noting a shortcoming in your position and implementing humor.

They were talking about the shifting political paradigms and contrasting some good anti-war leftists with pro-war anti-trump dems, and he rambled off a list of many pro-war dem talking points as examples of how crazy its gotten.
You managed to isolate one to paint a misleading picture.
The point wasn't 'this kurd thing is the issue and we are going to dodge it with TDS.'
The point was to discuss the freakish "cold warrior" shift of many democrats.

The general focus of libertarian and misesian foreign policy is the broader status of war and warmongering as it relates to the US, not the minutiae of a particular conflict or the feelings and prospects of a third party. (which is not to say they are opposed to discussing it)
You have essentially agreed that staying over there for the kurds is a shit idea and not the real concern of the pro-war dems, vindicating their commentary.

The happiness of my holidays is tbd, but glhf and Merry Christmas to you as well.

This post was edited by cambovenzi on Dec 21 2018 03:00pm

Dave Smith called this Syrian pullout "likely the best thing Trump has done". that's a fucking quote man.

if you think that means they are talking only about general war reduction and not the specifics of the Syrian pullout, idk what to say, i disagree. i dont want to have to listen to it again and make a transcript tho.

my point, which admittedly i didnt make inherently clear, is that the prominent libertarians that i've listened to in the last few days are celebrating a general anti-war move without touching the micro implications at all. i think this aversion to specifics shows they understand bad things are coming for the Kurds, don't want to say it outright and sound callous, so they celebrate the "win". I "clipped" that specific part of the video for a reason, because it exemplified my point. i did say in my initial post:



surely you must see though that statements such as this are strawmans:



what list? and it wasn't dishonest because it exemplified my point.



maybe more sardonic humor given the tranny bathroom closer.



nor do i expect them to, but when a host brings up a topic about the Dems referencing Kurds and then the guest responds "yeah Trump man, trump has them rattled" its a bit of a dodge. it wouldnt be noteworthy if i hadnt seen it repeated all over the place the last few days.



that one purely makes zero sense when aimed at me. just a miss, but you've been gone a while so perhaps that's it.




https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=79503433&f=119&o=400

yesterday fender went on about how im just an apologetic machine for Trump, today you say im distracting from TDS.

can you guys get together and figure out what narrative is the correct one plz?

This post was edited by thesnipa on Dec 21 2018 03:15pm