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Jun 29 2026 01:13am
my claim was they have used fake callers. doesnt mean you can turn it into a specific caller. you wouldnt do that because that would be dirty? right?

you didnt watch the vid. if you did you could represent the argument you say its making

its not a "magic" trick, its just a reasonable assumption. specially knowing the tricky tricks you like to play


I caught you in a lie you made unfounded assumptions to try dodge the main argument but to discredit the source instead. So not only do you not have proof of them bringing fake christians but even if you did somehow managed to prove it was staged it wouldn't in any way make the arguments themselves any less valid. You are just finding excuses not to address them.

Then you made another false claim that I personally didn't watch the video.

If you were literate AND watched the video yourself you would notice that I gave the example of tabernacle and the gold the very same argument made by Justin in the video. I even used his same words that you would needed a dump truck to do it. (I think this was around 30 min mark can't remember exactly) https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691634196 I even posted that same video short version a day or two earlier https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691543123


So in conclusion you don't even bother reading/watching what you are arguing against much less knowing what you are talking about. Further exposing your ignorance.
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Jun 29 2026 02:09am
Standard of proof is identical, the weight and reliability assigned to each type of evidence differ significantly:

Physical Evidence: Generally considered objective and tangible, providing concrete proof that can be measured or analyzed (e.g., DNA, fingerprints, weapons). It is less susceptible to subjective bias or memory lapses.

Personal Testimony: Is subjective and human-dependent, relying on the witness's credibility, perception, and memory. It is more vulnerable to challenges such as bias, inconsistency, or the hearsay rule, which excludes statements made outside of court unless an exception applies.

Extraordinary claims require Extraordinary evidence that are beyond reasonable doubt.

For example if someone is accused of murder and facing life in prison that evidence must be rock solid vs if someone is accused of stealing bubble gum.

If you claim jesus was an ordinary guy who spiritually resurrected my requirement for proof will be proportional to the claim.
If you claim jesus was "god" performed magic/miracles and physicaly resurrected he said/she said are no longer good enough by themselves. Testimony (non extraordinary evidence) will be considered as valid evidence but its value/weight isn't the same as physical/tangible proof.


I actually agree with much of what you've written.

Physical evidence generally carries more weight than testimony, and stronger claims require stronger evidence.

Where we differ is how that principle applies to history.

A unique historical event cannot leave behind the same kind of evidence as a repeatable scientific experiment. We don't have DNA, CCTV footage, or forensic reports from the first century. That isn't unique to Christianity—it's true of virtually all ancient history.

So historians work with the evidence that survives: documents, testimony, archaeology, manuscript transmission, and historical context.

The question isn't whether testimony is as strong as physical evidence—it isn't.

The question is whether the cumulative historical evidence is sufficient to justify belief in a particular event.

You keep treating "testimony" as though it's one piece of evidence. It isn't. Historians don't ask, "Is there a testimony?" They ask:

* How early is it?
* Is it independent?
* Is it internally consistent?
* Is it corroborated by other sources?
* Does it fit what we know historically?

That's how ancient history is evaluated.

So I don't accept the resurrection because of one anonymous story or because "the Bible told me so." I accept it because the cumulative historical case is stronger than competing explanations.
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Jun 29 2026 02:45am
I caught you in a lie you made unfounded assumptions to try dodge the main argument but to discredit the source instead. So not only do you not have proof of them bringing fake christians but even if you did somehow managed to prove it was staged it wouldn't in any way make the arguments themselves any less valid. You are just finding excuses not to address them.

Then you made another false claim that I personally didn't watch the video.

If you were literate AND watched the video yourself you would notice that I gave the example of tabernacle and the gold the very same argument made by Justin in the video. I even used his same words that you would needed a dump truck to do it. (I think this was around 30 min mark can't remember exactly) https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691634196 I even posted that same video short version a day or two earlier https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691543123


So in conclusion you don't even bother reading/watching what you are arguing against much less knowing what you are talking about. Further exposing your ignorance.

gee im just plum sorry i didnt save AE videos from years ago...........................
so thats why you been gone a while, watching a bit of the video.
no i dont watch your stuff. just returning the courtesy ty

This post was edited by TiStuff on Jun 29 2026 02:49am
Member
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Jun 29 2026 03:33am
I actually agree with much of what you've written.

Physical evidence generally carries more weight than testimony, and stronger claims require stronger evidence.

Where we differ is how that principle applies to history.

A unique historical event cannot leave behind the same kind of evidence as a repeatable scientific experiment. We don't have DNA, CCTV footage, or forensic reports from the first century. That isn't unique to Christianity—it's true of virtually all ancient history.

So historians work with the evidence that survives: documents, testimony, archaeology, manuscript transmission, and historical context.

The question isn't whether testimony is as strong as physical evidence—it isn't.

The question is whether the cumulative historical evidence is sufficient to justify belief in a particular event.

You keep treating "testimony" as though it's one piece of evidence. It isn't. Historians don't ask, "Is there a testimony?" They ask:

* How early is it?
* Is it independent?
* Is it internally consistent?
* Is it corroborated by other sources?
* Does it fit what we know historically?

That's how ancient history is evaluated.

So I don't accept the resurrection because of one anonymous story or because "the Bible told me so." I accept it because the cumulative historical case is stronger than competing explanations.


You are right when history claims magic it's usually discarded outright, but lets make an exception for your very specific magic story.

I treat the bible same way I treat Kitab’i-Aqdas or the Avesta or the Egyptian book of the dead. All magical claims are treated equally as absurd and unreliable. Much like you treat any other religious claims. You make exceptions for christianity while dismissing everything the competition claims.

The culminative evidence is lacking greatly when it comes to the bible.

There are no reliable firsthand eye witnesses, no independent contemporary testimonies, no records of all the major events that the bible purports outside the biblical text by any civilization, no archeological evidence for global flood, no evidence for most of the figures within the bible themselves, no evidence for any magical creatures that are described in the bible, no heaven, no hell to see, and most of all there is no sign of god anywhere its like he only existed some 2000 years in the bible and then never showed up ever again. As if he never existed in the first place.

Bible makes a number falsifiable claims yet no one has been able to prove them. Some claims are unknowable unless you have a time machine but the claims we can verify don't produce evidence required.

When you say you accept resurrection because "the cumulative historical case is stronger than competing explanations"
What do you mean by that? Do you accept that Liu Kang is real because he has the more credible fireball technique than Ryu?

This post was edited by addone on Jun 29 2026 03:47am
Member
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Jun 29 2026 04:07am
Matthew 12:38-42 ESV

The Sign of Jonah

38 Then some of the Pharisees and teachers of the law said to him, “Teacher, we want to see a sign from you.”

39 He answered, “A wicked and adulterous generation asks for a sign! But none will be given it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. 40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41 The men of Nineveh will stand up at the judgment with this generation and condemn it; for they repented at the preaching of Jonah, and now something greater than Jonah is here. 42 The Queen of the South will rise at the judgment with this generation and condemn it; for she came from the ends of the earth to listen to Solomon’s wisdom, and now something greater than Solomon is here.


Well this is contradictory to

Isaiah 7:10‐11
10Again the Lord spoke to Ahaz, 11“Ask the Lord your God for a sign, whether in the deepest depths or in the highest heights.”

Mathew 7:7
Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.

Judges 6
Gideon asks for a sign and god replies

2 Kings 20
Hezekiah asks for a sign

Moses constantly asks god for shit and he answers and performs all kind of magic LOL contradict much!

I ask for a simple reply christian apologists "No thats illegal !!!
Member
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Jun 29 2026 05:06am
gee im just plum sorry i didnt save AE videos from years ago...........................
so thats why you been gone a while, watching a bit of the video.
no i dont watch your stuff. just returning the courtesy ty


Your lame excuses are not going to work here. Also I already explained even if you did manage to find something it is irrelevant to the substance of the argument itself. Meaning accusing the show of fake guests doesn't excuse you from addressing the contradictions. This is known as ad hominem fallacy where you attack the source instead of the claim.

I already watched the video i made the argument literally on the same post BEFORE you accused me of not watching it. (Btw you still haven't addressed it) you have proven time and time again you have no genuine desire for truth and your actions are unchristian like.

You are exposing yourself as a fraud and a bad mannered troll
Member
Posts: 47,104
Joined: Sep 5 2016
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Jun 29 2026 05:25am
Your lame excuses are not going to work here. Also I already explained even if you did manage to find something it is irrelevant to the substance of the argument itself. Meaning accusing the show of fake guests doesn't excuse you from addressing the contradictions. This is known as ad hominem fallacy where you attack the source instead of the claim.

I already watched the video i made the argument literally on the same post BEFORE you accused me of not watching it. (Btw you still haven't addressed it) you have proven time and time again you have no genuine desire for truth and your actions are unchristian like.

You are exposing yourself as a fraud and a bad mannered troll


you talked a bunch of gibberish. u sound like a chat program with to many bugs

wut u said
(I think this was around 30 min mark can't remember exactly)
a du something like that some aways n stuff and tabernacle n gold something

person being exposed is you and your bad at trolling

This post was edited by TiStuff on Jun 29 2026 05:29am
Member
Posts: 16,160
Joined: Dec 27 2019
Gold: 69.69
Jun 29 2026 05:34am
you talked a bunch of gibberish. u sound like a chat program with to many bugs

wut u said
(I think this was around 30 min mark can't remember exactly)
a du something like that some aways n stuff and tabernacle n gold something


https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691634196

Failed to quote me, failed to watch and failed to respond to the actual argument.

Try again

(Ps your speech is deteriorating rapidly are you having a stroke?)
Member
Posts: 47,104
Joined: Sep 5 2016
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Jun 29 2026 05:53am
https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=107619089&f=119&p=691634196

Failed to quote me, failed to watch and failed to respond to the actual argument.

Try again

(Ps your speech is deteriorating rapidly are you having a stroke?)


yaya posting a link to bogus AE vid 2 hours long and im supposed to watch it .............. lol
Member
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Jun 29 2026 06:20am
yaya posting a link to bogus AE vid 2 hours long and im supposed to watch it .............. lol


You didn't HAVE to watch the entire video I literally gave you an argument (which you failed to read and still refusing to address) on the same post. Video was more of a reference for further detailed explanations. Later I gave you an approximate time stamp to further eliminate your excuses.
Also its not bogus since you haven't refuted anything.

Look if this is too difficult for you and you wish to tap out be my guest but don't lie to me or give lame excuses. I prefer you concede the argument entirely but since I know you are too stubborn and dogmatic i'll settle for a simple "sit this one out". You aren't adding anything which is intelligent or coherent to the discussion just more fallacies and uneducated remarks.
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