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#2611
Jun 1 2026 04:12am
Quote (addone @ Jun 1 2026 01:52am)
No you are making shit up as usual. If you can't prove your god better keep quiet, no one asked your opinions on Dawkins or hear you cry about science.
Science is a different subject entirely this is about your proof of your magic claims and nothing else.

Clearly you don't have it.


'atheism gas already admitted nothing could possibly be proved because they are already committed to martialism

“We have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism… we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.” — Richard Lewontin

'atheism has become the nowhere man who has nothing just like the title of lawence krauss book. more meaningful in the world of meaningless then anyone could have possibly imagined

Quote (majorblood @ Jun 1 2026 02:27am)
the issue with this thread is you're asking for empirical evidence for the triune God who transcends materialism, it's a category error, it's similar in error to asking me what the concept of 5 tastes like. empiricism has nothing to say about the non-material and empiricism itself cannot even justify its own axioms. for empiricism to be valid we have to justify the preconditions of logic itself, which is why i gave you a metalogical argument on like page 2 or 3 of this thread. no other worldview other than the orthodox christian worldview can coherently explain the preconditions for intelligibility and attempting to debate that is far more interesting than just posting like reddit tier memes to me. idk how you have no genuine interest in epistemology or metaphysics or any topic of philosophy and actually coherently understanding worldviews. the orthodox christian worldview completely and coherently explains the validity of empiricism, but you have not offered any reason why we ought accept your undefined worldview that cannot justify empiricism.

what you're doing is completely borrowing the metaphysical baggage of christianity that is the foundation for your entire epistemology including the possibility of science, empiricism, and then simply denying metaphysics without offering an alternative worldview that can justify the possibility of intelligibility.

it's why we're making 0 progress in this thread, there is no neutral worldview and everything is theory-laden so without justification of your own worldview we can make no progress.


he is in his own godhood
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#2612
Jun 1 2026 04:52am
Quote (TiStuff @ Jun 1 2026 06:12am)
'atheism gas already admitted nothing could possibly be proved because they are already committed to martialism

“We have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism… we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.” — Richard Lewontin

'atheism has become the nowhere man who has nothing just like the title of lawence krauss book. more meaningful in the world of meaningless then anyone could have possibly imagined



he is in his own godhood


its june first. you got better arguments now then the bible.
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#2613
Jun 1 2026 05:08am
Quote (majorblood @ Jun 1 2026 09:27pm)
the issue with this thread is you're asking for empirical evidence for the triune God who transcends materialism, it's a category error, it's similar in error to asking me what the concept of 5 tastes like. empiricism has nothing to say about the non-material and empiricism itself cannot even justify its own axioms. for empiricism to be valid we have to justify the preconditions of logic itself, which is why i gave you a metalogical argument on like page 2 or 3 of this thread. no other worldview other than the orthodox christian worldview can coherently explain the preconditions for intelligibility and attempting to debate that is far more interesting than just posting like reddit tier memes to me. idk how you have no genuine interest in epistemology or metaphysics or any topic of philosophy and actually coherently understanding worldviews. the orthodox christian worldview completely and coherently explains the validity of empiricism, but you have not offered any reason why we ought accept your undefined worldview that cannot justify empiricism.

what you're doing is completely borrowing the metaphysical baggage of christianity that is the foundation for your entire epistemology including the possibility of science, empiricism, and then simply denying metaphysics without offering an alternative worldview that can justify the possibility of intelligibility.

it's why we're making 0 progress in this thread, there is no neutral worldview and everything is theory-laden so without justification of your own worldview we can make no progress.


Faith based-presuppositions are not credible. It opens a Pandora's box of uncontested beliefs. There is no discerning between voices in people's heads.
Empirical evidence has the privilege of granting us observable, verifiable and tangible proof its not perfect but its close. Given the extraordinary claims christianity makes it has very little to no empirical proof.

Most of the bible and its many claims can be verified with empirical evidence yet you have not provided a single one. Hiding behind categorical error excuse isn't going to save you.

If I engage your debate on metalogic you will end up appealing to ignorance and I would have no way of knowing or verifying other than your word.
This is a mostly fruitless debate given the aim of this thread but it might have some philosophical merit.

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#2614
Jun 1 2026 05:32am
Quote (4nt @ Jun 1 2026 03:52am)
its june first. you got better arguments now then the bible.

some people comprehend what they are looking at. once in a while even a 'atheist rises from his fitful slumber
Quote
A commonsense interpretation of the facts suggests that a superintellect has monkeyed with physics, as well as with chemistry and biology, and that there are no blind forces worth speaking about in nature. The numbers one calculates from the facts seem to me so overwhelming as to put this conclusion almost beyond question.

Fred Hoyle

i always find it amusing he uses the word monkeyed :)




Quote (addone @ Jun 1 2026 04:08am)
Faith based-presuppositions are not credible. It opens a Pandora's box of uncontested beliefs. There is no discerning between voices in people's heads.
Empirical evidence has the privilege of granting us observable, verifiable and tangible proof its not perfect but its close. Given the extraordinary claims christianity makes it has very little to no empirical proof.

Most of the bible and its many claims can be verified with empirical evidence yet you have not provided a single one. Hiding behind categorical error excuse isn't going to save you.

If I engage your debate on metalogic you will end up appealing to ignorance and I would have no way of knowing or verifying other than your word.
This is a mostly fruitless debate given the aim of this thread but it might have some philosophical merit.


it used to be the imaginations of man decided the universe was static and eternal. which 'disproved scripture therefore disproving the God of scripture. with the invention of the hubbel telescope it was calculated that the universe was expanding. if its expanding then it had a beginning. which is harmonious with scripture.

the lesson learned
when mans imagination (making it up) figures out stuff its always in conflict with scripture (i wonder what that is?)
empirical science/ hard science is always in harmony with scripture

This post was edited by TiStuff on Jun 1 2026 05:37am
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#2615
Jun 1 2026 07:10am
Quote (4nt @ Jun 1 2026 06:52am)
its june first. you got better arguments now then the bible.


We can look at any form of creation in our world and break down the design and see just how much intelligence is behind the design. There is so much complexity to the human body. The entire human organism is remarkably complex because it integrates multiple systems like nervous, immune, circulatory, endocrine, digestive, and others that constantly communicate and self-regulate. The immune system alone involves billions of cells and countless molecular interactions. The human brain contains roughly 86 billion neurons connected by hundreds of trillions of synapses, creating an extraordinarily intricate network capable of consciousness, language, abstract reasoning, and memory.

A system this complex at some point had a male and female occur to start the human race.

If your conclusion is that it all happened accidently from a state of nothing then that's on you refusing to know something is greater beyond our human existence. None of this is possible unless there is a creator that is outside of time not bound to the natural that we experience. A state of eternal. There wasn't and never could of been this state of nothing and then big bang wow look, life.

No, it just isn't possible.
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#2616
Jun 1 2026 08:07am
Quote (D_urRRR @ Jun 1 2026 09:10am)
We can look at any form of creation in our world and break down the design and see just how much intelligence is behind the design. There is so much complexity to the human body. The entire human organism is remarkably complex because it integrates multiple systems like nervous, immune, circulatory, endocrine, digestive, and others that constantly communicate and self-regulate. The immune system alone involves billions of cells and countless molecular interactions. The human brain contains roughly 86 billion neurons connected by hundreds of trillions of synapses, creating an extraordinarily intricate network capable of consciousness, language, abstract reasoning, and memory.

A system this complex at some point had a male and female occur to start the human race.

If your conclusion is that it all happened accidently from a state of nothing then that's on you refusing to know something is greater beyond our human existence. None of this is possible unless there is a creator that is outside of time not bound to the natural that we experience. A state of eternal. There wasn't and never could of been this state of nothing and then big bang wow look, life.

No, it just isn't possible.


I believe in god just not any religion
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#2617
Jun 1 2026 08:27am
Quote (4nt @ Jun 1 2026 07:07am)
I believe in god just not any religion


i dont think it is just "any religion"
there is no work in alll the world like this, not even close.

the bible is a collection of 66 books
written over a period of approximately 1400-1500 years
in 3 different languages across 3 different continents
by over 40 different authors from every walk of life (from a kings throne to a prison cell)
most who never knew each other and many of them die a horrible death rather then deny their faith.
with no historical errors or contradictions
coming together in one singe unified harmonious message
THE CREATION, FALL AND REDEMPTION
GODS UNIVERSAL LOVE FOR ALL HUMANITY
a common message of salvation is available to all who repent their sins and commit to following God with all their heart, soul, strength and mind.

the bolded part is important. God of scripture offers salvation to all of mankind. there are no exceptions. there is no skin color exceptions.
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#2618
Jun 1 2026 08:48am
Quote (4nt @ Jun 1 2026 10:07am)
I believe in god just not any religion


Looks like you and I agree on something.

God bless you.
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#2619
Jun 1 2026 04:33pm
Quote (addone @ Jun 1 2026 04:08am)
Faith based-presuppositions are not credible. It opens a Pandora's box of uncontested beliefs. There is no discerning between voices in people's heads.
Empirical evidence has the privilege of granting us observable, verifiable and tangible proof its not perfect but its close. Given the extraordinary claims christianity makes it has very little to no empirical proof.

Most of the bible and its many claims can be verified with empirical evidence yet you have not provided a single one. Hiding behind categorical error excuse isn't going to save you.

If I engage your debate on metalogic you will end up appealing to ignorance and I would have no way of knowing or verifying other than your word.
This is a mostly fruitless debate given the aim of this thread but it might have some philosophical merit.


who said anything about faith-based presuppositions or voices in your head? i'm talking about philosophical argumentation

you need to justify empiricism within your own (presumptive) materialistic paradigm before we can even attempt to test empirical claims of the bible.

i do not grant you empiricism as valid and you must justify it within your own worldview, because me just granting your position is no different than you just granting christianity as valid. there are no neutral worldviews, you are borrowing from mine even if you don't realize it.


a transcendental argument is the exact opposite of an appeal to ignorance so I don't think you know what you're talking about here.

it is not "you can't prove x is false, therefore x is true." it is the argument is the impossibility of the contrary proves the claim.

x is the precondition for y, y therefore x. + impossibility of the contrary, it is a valid logical argument.

it might be fruitless because you don't have interest in philosophy and are unwilling to change, but it doesn't mean it's not true.
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#2620
Jun 1 2026 06:00pm
Quote (majorblood @ Jun 2 2026 10:33am)
who said anything about faith-based presuppositions or voices in your head? i'm talking about philosophical argumentation

you need to justify empiricism within your own (presumptive) materialistic paradigm before we can even attempt to test empirical claims of the bible.

i do not grant you empiricism as valid and you must justify it within your own worldview, because me just granting your position is no different than you just granting christianity as valid. there are no neutral worldviews, you are borrowing from mine even if you don't realize it.


a transcendental argument is the exact opposite of an appeal to ignorance so I don't think you know what you're talking about here.

it is not "you can't prove x is false, therefore x is true." it is the argument is the impossibility of the contrary proves the claim.

x is the precondition for y, y therefore x. + impossibility of the contrary, it is a valid logical argument.

it might be fruitless because you don't have interest in philosophy and are unwilling to change, but it doesn't mean it's not true.


You have some kind of theoretical degree that has very little practical application you wasted your time and money on studying and its showing.
How is emperical evidence not valid? If I punch you in the face will that convince you of its validity? Or will you say my punch isn't preconditioned for your face?

Everyone understands it immediately unless you have some kind of brain tumor that prohibits self preservation.

Same way the bible claims jesus was here in the flesh and performed magical acts such as resurrecting himself and other people from the dead, the global flood should have left very specific and identifiable empirical markers, not to mention exhaustive independent literature that corroborates such a historic event. We have none or at least very few questionable/partial second hand accounts. Thats like saying Bigfoot exists and all you have is I heard it from my uncles friend who says he knows a guy who knows a guy's cousin that read it in a book he found.

Why can't you accept that is not valid evidence for a magical story and dismiss the bible on lack of proof?

This post was edited by addone on Jun 1 2026 06:00pm
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