The United States has been sending aid to Israel consistently since 1946. It has been a lot of aid.

We sent more aid to Ukraine in a five year span than we have to Israel in an 80-year span though… god damnit, those shadowy Ukrainians must have co-opted our democratic process.

Every dumb opinion is obvious from a European standpoint, because you guys are totally unconcerned with truth. It’s ok, Europe gets to be dumb by right of also being totally ineffectual.

Let me know when all your politicians take money from "AUPAC".

Our politicians take more money from realtors than from AIPAC. I think it would be just as silly if OP had said our leaders "got no real power" and all the decisions are being made by realtors.

I don't like lobbying in general, I don't think anybody does. You guys massively overestimate the power of AIPAC tho.

The vast majority of aid to Israel isn't accounted for as aid. Most of it dark money, and then the rest is the insane amount of blood & military funds used to fight Israel's wars for them. How much is a dead Canadian or American worth? Tally that and then add up every single military expenditure in the Middle East since 1946.

The "dark money" comment is based on a clear misunderstanding of what black budgets are. Yes, we share some of the intelligence paid for with black budgets with Israel, as well as our other allies. No, this does not cost us hundreds of billions of dollars, the vast majority is intelligence we would have gathered regardless and the sharing of it costs nothing. If you have proof that this is untrue then share it.

I don't know if this answers your question or not but if Iran had shot down a passenger plane in 2020, killing 60 Americans and an American court ruled that it was an intentional act of terrorism, Khamenei would have died in 2020. But they were Canadians and it was a Canadian court that ruled it an intentional act of terrorism so instead of asking America for help killing the man responsible you guys nicely asked an international court to nicely ask Iran to send you some money. America does not put a price on the lives of it's citizens. If you attack us, we fly across the world and destroy you. So, no, you also can not add all of the American military expenditure in the Middle East since 1946.

Nice Gish Gallop!
I find it impressive how you managed to cram so much historical illiteracy into one comment. Blaming Israel for every American war in the Middle East is just a desperate attempt to absolve the region of its own internal, centuries-old chaos.

1. The U.S. went into Afghanistan because of 9/11 Bin Laden’s stated motive was U.S. troops stationed in Saudi Arabia after the Gulf War, not Israel
2. The First Gulf War happened because Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait to steal its oil, again not Israel.
3. The Syrian civil war was a product of the Arab Spring and Assad slaughtering his own people, again not Israel
Blaming Israel for Sunni-Shia conflicts, Iranian imperialism, or global jihadist groups is completely unhinged.


Your 'circular logic' claim about U.S. interests is also historically backward. The U.S. cemented its strategic footprint in the Middle East in 1945 when FDR secured a pact with Saudi Arabia's Ibn Saud three years before Israel even existed. The U.S. is there to secure global energy flows, protect vital shipping lanes like the Suez Canal and the Strait of Hormuz, and counter Soviet (and now Russian/Chinese) influence. Israel is simply the only stable, democratic anchor in a volatile region that prevents those interests from totally collapsing.
As for the 'bad ally' myth: bringing up the USS Liberty a tragic friendly-fire incident from 1967 that was extensively investigated and closed by the U.S. military decades ago and randomly stringing it together with the Abraham Accords is just pure word salad. You conveniently ignore that the U.S.-Israel alliance is a massive two-way street. Israel serves as a real-time R&D laboratory for the United States. Jointly developed technologies, like the Arrow systems for exoatmospheric ballistic missile interception, or the deployment of directed-energy weapons like Iron Beam, don't just protect Israel. They provide the U.S. military with battle-tested data and tech to protect American troops and allies globally.

For last, the Argentina comment is a cute historical footnote, but your dig about 'telling your grandkids when it's time to enlist' completely misses the point. Sovereignty exacts a toll. Building a thriving, high-tech powerhouse that survives and wins despite its neighborhood isn't a failure. The fact that future generations will continue to enlist to defend their home isn't a tragedy it is the exact guarantee that the helpless, stateless reality of the Jewish people pre-1948 will never happen again.

Check your Numbers again please. USA sent more to Israel… you are right of you take last 2 years, but no if you take last 10 years.
And thats nos what i asked, you just said hey we help ukraine too, im asking if american citizen thinks they are ruled by israel or no

Intelligence is only a small fraction of the dark money sent to Israel. Most of it is transferred via political graft, embezzled taxpayer dollars, to so-called "Americans" who are in fact loyal to Israel and "invest" all the funds there. Again, all of this is deliberately hidden as it is willful treachery & fraud.

I am referring to the deaths of soldiers, American, Canadian, and others within the Western and NATO-sphere who have been sent to die for Israel in their wars like cattle. Here you are invoking American's right to self defence - following this line of reasoning, the Muslim nations, many of which being fragments of the Ottoman Caliphate, also have that right. Remember that Israel & America (including America's collaborationist vassal states) are the aggressors in this long war - beginning with the US sponsored invasion of Palestine by jewish terrorists, who committed a laundry list of war crimes including the poisoning of wells, biological weapons, and slaughter of civilians. Any attack since then on America is a rightful act of self defence while American retaliation is illegitimate, only an act of continued aggression.

Israel has no right to exist under all interpretations of modern International Law. If you would like to invoke the right of conquest, or law of the jungle so to speak, the October 7th Hamas raid into Israel is entirely legitimate. Otherwise it is simple hypocrisy, or "rules for thee but not for me". Also, the impending violent destruction of Israel will also be entirely legitimate.

Almost spat my coffee. Was going to write up a sarcastic 'dont be a antisemitic' to the OPs genuine criticisms.

You beat me to it. The Israel lobby has endless munitions of rhetoric nonsense while the US has supplies the hard rounds

This post was edited by RedFromWinter on Apr 18 2026 06:21am

Sarcasm isn't a counter-argument. If you think a strategic partnership that functions as a circular subsidy for the U.S. defense industry is 'rhetoric,' you don't understand how Washington works. The U.S. doesn't do charity; it buys interests. If Israel 'ruled' D.C., our hands wouldn't be tied in Lebanon right now. Address the facts or keep the theatrics