From Europe we see something obvious for us, Israel and jewish lobby rules over USA, you got no real power to make what you want, every year usa gives thousands of millions to Israel, when Israel said attack Iran, you attacked and by my point of view you cant criticize nothing about Israel.
Do you hace same point of view or in usa, people think they are real free and you take the decisions?

Make it simple and just say billions.
The only thing US cannot exactly do is to go against the Jewish lobby.

Well.... not that they can't ... they can...but there are dire consequences...

Just wait and see what happens to the likes of Tucker Carlson, Candace Owens... all who were Pro Trump / Pro Republican voters who turned against the Jewish Lobby and Israel in USA.
Their days are numbered.

Is'rul

seems sometimes USA panders to israel and sometimes to islam.
europe also seems to pander to islam
none of it really makes any sense.
unless perhaps it does when scripture is considered?

Pandering to Israel has zero scriptural backing. Islam is after scripture, so also has no relevance.

agree

It’s a common trope, but the reality is a bit more 'boring.' The U.S. doesn't give aid out of the goodness of its heart or because it’s 'ruled'; it does it because Israel is essentially a massive, land-based aircraft carrier for U.S. interests in a chaotic region. Most of that 'money' is actually credit that must be spent on American defense companies so it’s effectively a subsidy for the U.S. arms industry. As for Iran, if the U.S. did everything Israel wanted, that conflict would have looked very different years ago. We’re partners, but trust me, Washington always puts its own interests first.

Example from now forcing our hands down in Lebanon.

the number one reason we need a military base nation in the middle east is to protect israel. so we need israel to protect israel.

before the creation of israel none of the middle eastern countries were committing acts of global terror to any relevant degree. but now we need israel to fight terrorists, who commit terror because we created israel, and because we waged wars in the region on behalf of israel.

israel created a problem then sold itself as the solution. you might say its the final solution.

The idea that the Middle East was a peaceful vacuum before 1948 is one of the biggest historical myths out there. Israel didn’t 'introduce' terror to the region; it was born into a neighborhood that had been a violent flashpoint for centuries

The U.S. was fighting there in 1801: Over 140 years before Israel existed, the U.S. fought its first overseas wars (the Barbary Wars) in North Africa and the Middle East. The reason? State-sponsored piracy, kidnapping, and attacks on trade. American military intervention in the region is older than the U.S. Constitution's Bill of Rights

The 1920s and 30s Mandate Era: Decades before 1948, the region was defined by constant massacres, bombings, and uprisings.

You had the 1929 Hebron Massacre, the 1936 Arab Revolt, and militias on all sides (including Jewish groups like the Irgun and Arab nationalist groups) using what we’d today call terror tactics against each other and the British.

European Terror isn't about Borders: If you look at the manifestos of groups like ISIS, they explicitly state they attack the West for its secularism and liberal values, not just foreign policy. The biggest waves of terror in Europe (like the Paris and Brussels attacks) were fueled by the vacuum in Syria and Iraq, not by Israel

Claiming 1948 was the 'starting point' for regional violence is like jumping into a movie two hours late and blaming the last character who walked on screen for the mess in the room. The conflict existed long before, and the 'reasons' for terror in Europe are much more about failed integration and global extremist ideologies than they are about a single border in the Levant

For last you didn't create anything the west often tried to stop it: People forget that the British, who ruled the region before 1948, actually issued the 'White Paper of 1939' to block Jewish immigration and land purchases. The Israelis had to fight a guerrilla war against the British to gain independence. Even when the state was declared, the U.S. maintained an arms embargo on the region. Israel wasn't 'built' by Western hands; it was built by refugees who fought the British and then survived an invasion by five surrounding armies using mostly smuggled Czechoslovakian weapons.

the region wasn't peaceful, but it was nothing like the absolute pit of snakes and terrorists it is today. and issues in the middle east often stayed within the middle east or were at worst an annoyance for the western civilized world.

but conveniently you offered me a history lesson instead of dealing with the meat of my argument. the US's main interest in the middle east is protecting Israel, and Israel's main purpose for the USA is giving us an "ally" in the middle east. That's circular logic.

if we could snap our fingers and erase the creation of israel then fast forward to 2026 we'd be buying oil and fertilizer from the same shitty muslim nations that we have now, but without spending trillions of dollars on the iraqi, afgani, syrian, and iranian wars (among others).

but hey, we're "partners" right? "allies" right? is that why you refused nuclear inspections and set up fake reactors and tried to trick US inspectors under Kennedy? is that why you bomb people we're actively negotiating with? tell us you're opening up a war knowing our bases and soldiers will be bombed? they should have called the abraham accords the uss liberty accords because you blew it up in gaza.

we should stop talking about if israel has a right to exist and get to a more prudent and straightforward topic, if it should exist at all. it shouldnt. you should have built a nation in argentina, but they knew they wouldnt get as many dumb people to move there as they would the holy land. how has that worked out? some day you can tell your great grand kids when its their time to enlist how wonderful its gone.