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Dec 13 2025 04:03pm
this is a very bad stat it includes many more than just race


what metric are you using and what evidence supports your position? also, the irony? is that the US is in the middle of a culture wars where half the country hates the other half. so calling the US nationalist or patriotic has to somehow get over that hurdle...

finally, if you are talking about diversity i guess you dont include all the native indians (that the europeans, now americans) killed?

i cant think of any metric related to diversity where the US would be #1.

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 13 2025 04:07pm
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Dec 13 2025 04:06pm
what metric are you using and what evidence supports your position?


do a quick google... the stats ur statistics includes mnay similarly blooded people that have different culture... im talking about being a melting pot of people in the world

a lot of what ur looking at includes small countries with small populations that have simply not connected and melded
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Dec 13 2025 04:08pm
do a quick google... the stats ur statistics includes mnay similarly blooded people that have different culture... im talking about being a melting pot of people in the world

a lot of what ur looking at includes small countries with small populations that have simply not connected and melded


Well, lets say England, or Holland, those look to be way more diverse then the US, as a % population.

if i tinker around i can get to this statement: The U.S. has the largest and longest-standing mix of immigrant-origin populations drawn from every inhabited continent, spread across an entire continent-sized country.

im going to go away now. i hope this helps you.

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 13 2025 04:10pm
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Dec 13 2025 05:18pm
Fascism as a structured centralized power to serve mutual benefit of a people defined by allegiance to a national identity rather than subjugation by a self-serving autocracy/monarchy, exists at least as far as the foundation of the Roman republic and more likely has its most distant roots in the temple economies of the bronze age and hence as much as 5000 years past. Communism, as a classless society with communal production and distribution, has never even been attempted until the 20th century and then only existed with obviously inherently unstable approximations

20th century fascists were in an ideological feud with the nascent communists, who were driven by new, revolutionary and untested ideas. Fascism already existed throughout history and has competed with monarchies in several civilizations, and some societies drifted between the two as power was more centralized and removed from the people and in others served the people and their barons. The closest thing to communism to ever exist before Karl Marx is some isolated island tribes and even there its usually the biggest maori eats his rival and bangs his girl


Slave revolts are older than recorded history. "Communism" is no different from a slave revolt - a legitimate desire for a just, prosperous, and equitable society without understanding how to get there.

"Fascism" is simply the founding of our post-oligarchy Western civilization, codified by Caesar. "Fascism" rejects heritidary castes & hereditary monarchy in favour of rule by the collective will of the People. Invented just over 2000 years ago yeah, and the foundation of our entire epistomological structure. Hell it's our calendar and entire cosmology.

This post was edited by El1te on Dec 13 2025 05:22pm
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Dec 13 2025 05:39pm
if your argument is that communism existed even before it was called that, and that communism is always bad, then you're saying 99% of human existence in which we flourished pretty well was bad. all tribal life of humans, even when we lived in small bands, can be called communism by loose definition. really all life before capitalism can be described as communist.


Tribal society WAS bad. Tribal society has never flourished, not once in human history. Tribes were perpetually at war, fighting not in pitched battles but by trading night raids. This is what North American was before it was conquered. Sioux, Arikara, Pawnee, etc. etc. all killing each other. Tribal society evolved to city states which evolved to nation states with evolved to empire states.

King Agamemnon did a great thing by uniting the various Greek states. "I made a nation out of fire worshippers and snake eaters".

This post was edited by El1te on Dec 13 2025 05:40pm
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Dec 13 2025 05:47pm
Slave revolts are older than recorded history. "Communism" is no different from a slave revolt - a legitimate desire for a just, prosperous, and equitable society without understanding how to get there.

"Fascism" is simply the founding of our post-oligarchy Western civilization, codified by Caesar. "Fascism" rejects heritidary castes & hereditary monarchy in favour of rule by the collective will of the People. Invented just over 2000 years ago yeah, and the foundation of our entire epistomological structure. Hell it's our calendar and entire cosmology.


I'd figure the vast majority of slave revolts weren't by people who wanted to establish any kind of egalitarianism but rather to get themselves out of bondage, or more commonly, make themselves the new slavemasters. The first servile war was sparked by a slave who wanted to be king and subjugate the aristocrats, and didn't even oppose the institution of slavery just their own enslavement. The third war with Spartacus saw them commit many atrocities on civilians, and no ancient historian mentions any egalitarian or ideological motive at all. And lord knows how many more recent slave states in Africa wound up being slavers themselves

Fascism is more than mere centralized authority like a monarchy or empire. Now I know its infamously resilient to definition, but fascism has to come down to its root identity as the strength of the multitude united: Fascism is the concept of an authoritarian national identity, to the exclusion of everyone else. The romans first codified fascism in the republic, which was a democratic institution rather than autocracy but clearly gave us an example of a national identity that placed roman citizens above all others. It wasn't necessary a rejection of hereditary castes or even the dynastic monarch as they had striations between common people and equistrians and senators, populares and optimates- and persisted through the transition to the roman empire. They still identified themselves by their strength in unity, which only really started to degrade around the time of Caracalla making citizenship too watered down.

I don't think fascism is necessarily mutually exclusive with a lot of other labels we put on governments. It could be democratic or autocratic or plutocratic. It could be the thought experiment of Heinlein in starship troopers, a militaristic society that is egalitarian and provides social services but limits citizenship and political force to those it deems hold civic responsibility, ie the military. Because fascism is right there in the namesake fasces (bundle of sticks tied together with axe in it), the faggot (bundle of sticks tied together) is stronger together than as a solitary fag (singular stick)
I think what really distinguishes fascism is;
  • National identity is dominant and exclusive
  • It serves the interests of the collective people, not their masters


I don't think monarchies really qualify if a King serving the people is taken as benevolence rather than duty, if an aristocracy can exist entitled to the fruits of people's labors rather than the people serving their own interests by working together.

This post was edited by Goomshill on Dec 13 2025 05:51pm
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Dec 13 2025 06:34pm
I'd figure the vast majority of slave revolts weren't by people who wanted to establish any kind of egalitarianism but rather to get themselves out of bondage, or more commonly, make themselves the new slavemasters. The first servile war was sparked by a slave who wanted to be king and subjugate the aristocrats, and didn't even oppose the institution of slavery just their own enslavement. The third war with Spartacus saw them commit many atrocities on civilians, and no ancient historian mentions any egalitarian or ideological motive at all. And lord knows how many more recent slave states in Africa wound up being slavers themselves

Fascism is more than mere centralized authority like a monarchy or empire. Now I know its infamously resilient to definition, but fascism has to come down to its root identity as the strength of the multitude united: Fascism is the concept of an authoritarian national identity, to the exclusion of everyone else. The romans first codified fascism in the republic, which was a democratic institution rather than autocracy but clearly gave us an example of a national identity that placed roman citizens above all others. It wasn't necessary a rejection of hereditary castes or even the dynastic monarch as they had striations between common people and equistrians and senators, populares and optimates- and persisted through the transition to the roman empire. They still identified themselves by their strength in unity, which only really started to degrade around the time of Caracalla making citizenship too watered down.

I don't think fascism is necessarily mutually exclusive with a lot of other labels we put on governments. It could be democratic or autocratic or plutocratic. It could be the thought experiment of Heinlein in starship troopers, a militaristic society that is egalitarian and provides social services but limits citizenship and political force to those it deems hold civic responsibility, ie the military. Because fascism is right there in the namesake fasces (bundle of sticks tied together with axe in it), the faggot (bundle of sticks tied together) is stronger together than as a solitary fag (singular stick)
I think what really distinguishes fascism is;
  • National identity is dominant and exclusive
  • It serves the interests of the collective people, not their masters


I don't think monarchies really qualify if a King serving the people is taken as benevolence rather than duty, if an aristocracy can exist entitled to the fruits of people's labors rather than the people serving their own interests by working together.


There is no difference in the outcomes between the slave revolts you described and communism. Communism has been what you have described - a group of people becoming new slave masters. The Communist rulers living lives of extreme luxury and opulence at the expense of the common people. Yet still, the sentiment among the people that drove those communist revolutions was the desire for a more just and equitable society. While we can't read peoples minds from thousands of years ago, I do not doubt that the common slaves held that exact same sentiment.

In the present day, the belief that humans are either the male or female sex has been described as Fascism by the ruling class, so I'd say it being resilient to definition is an understatement. Simply it is of course the principle that there is strength in unity and weakness in division - a principle that is self evidently true. The Roman Republic was significantly more "fascist" than its rival at the time, Carthage, but it was very far from a democracy. The Roman Republic was a hereditary aristocracy - only Patricians could be senators, and senators were appointed by Censors, not elected. It was however significantly more democratic than rival states at the time, with plebs having some enfranchisement in local affairs. The ascendance of Caesar and his democratic ideology made the Roman Empire significantly more democratic than the Republic, and saw the abolishment of heritidary castes among our civilization. Carthage was however nearly a pure oligarchy - the rulers were merchant lords, and the bulk of their armed forces were mercenaries, contrasting the Roman Republic which raised armies from the free citizenry and trained them through institutions. The oligarchic system was nearly wiped off the planet with the doom of Carthage, and then the doom of the anti-democratic Brutus and friends, but has seen a resurgence in the past century+ with the present hegemony of an ever-progressing Jewish oligarchy - a system that unfortunately persisted after its just destruction following the revelation of Christ.

All in all a great description, no society ever cleanly fits a label in the present era. Ideas persist through centuries, nearly all of our (Western) institutions are still Roman.

This post was edited by El1te on Dec 13 2025 06:39pm
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Dec 13 2025 07:03pm
All power ends up in a few hands unless we take corporations money out of politics. Put a cap on election donations.. Like there was, now it is unlimited spending ... That means the wealthier a person is the more they influence the election. One way to stem fascism .. The way it is now money spent decides the election almost 100% of the time.. So all they have to do is kill the 0.1 percent that comes close to winning.. or cheat them some how with media owned .. Like they did Bernie.. or Jesse Ventura .. or JFK them if they do not Obey..

America is a idea that is great ..But it is not the reality we have today
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Dec 13 2025 07:46pm
There is no difference in the outcomes between the slave revolts you described and communism. Communism has been what you have described - a group of people becoming new slave masters. The Communist rulers living lives of extreme luxury and opulence at the expense of the common people. Yet still, the sentiment among the people that drove those communist revolutions was the desire for a more just and equitable society. While we can't read peoples minds from thousands of years ago, I do not doubt that the common slaves held that exact same sentiment.


You're conflating the results with the ideology.
Communism is an ideological goal of an egalitarian classless society where each is given according to his need and from each according to his ability. That communism in practice has always resulted in autocratic states or just total implosion or evolving into capitalist societies- is just a product of the inherent instability of communism. Because capitalism is a self-reinforcing stable system and communism is self-destabilizing.

All the historical slave revolts, popular revolutions, regime changes, etc from thousands of years of history prior to Karl Marx were not driven by any ideology remotely similar to communism. They can result in the same outcomes, but that's because those are the same outcomes every power vacuum develops. When enslaved people revolt just they hate being enslaved and want to be the new masters, it isn't the same as a radical philosophy saying we should have nationalized joint ownership of production and distribution so everyone is given equal shares.

Quote
In the present day, the belief that humans are either the male or female sex has been described as Fascism by the ruling class, so I'd say it being resilient to definition is an understatement. Simply it is of course the principle that there is strength in unity and weakness in division - a principle that is self evidently true. The Roman Republic was significantly more "fascist" than its rival at the time, Carthage, but it was very far from a democracy. The Roman Republic was a hereditary aristocracy - only Patricians could be senators, and senators were appointed by Censors, not elected. It was however significantly more democratic than rival states at the time, with plebs having some enfranchisement in local affairs. The ascendance of Caesar and his democratic ideology made the Roman Empire significantly more democratic than the Republic, and saw the abolishment of heritidary castes among our civilization. Carthage was however nearly a pure oligarchy - the rulers were merchant lords, and the bulk of their armed forces were mercenaries, contrasting the Roman Republic which raised armies from the free citizenry and trained them through institutions. The oligarchic system was nearly wiped off the planet with the doom of Carthage, and then the doom of the anti-democratic Brutus and friends, but has seen a resurgence in the past century+ with the present hegemony of an ever-progressing Jewish oligarchy - a system that unfortunately persisted after its just destruction following the revelation of Christ.

All in all a great description, no society ever cleanly fits a label in the present era. Ideas persist through centuries, nearly all of our (Western) institutions are still Roman.


I don't think all the exaggerations and conflations and misuse of fascism as a term actually change the underlying concept, which stays the same it ever was. After all, language is just a tool to express concepts and serves only when it is mutually intelligible. People babbling about anyone not agreeing with their gender ideology dogma being fascists, well that just makes them idiots, it doesn't change the philosophy of fascism.

Even if Rome wasn't a pure fascism, the elements were right there. The bureaucracy of government was absolutely set up for the popular benefit of the citizenry. Laws were passed and public works commissioned not for the benefit of the aristocracy or to subjugate the masses, they were for the citizens. That identity remained intact for nearly a thousand years. The citizens of rome worked together for the common good of rome, creating infrastructure and armies and technology that surpassed every contemporary and remained a zenith for centuries. The aqueducts weren't designed to bring water to the senators, the colosseum wasn't built for the amusement of the equestrians. The soldiers could kill emperors and rise new ones from their ranks. Every man who could say he was a roman citizen benefited from roman achievements and could enter a bathhouse or import wine from overseas.

The biggest mark against Rome being fascist is the lack of single party totalitarianism, which throughout Roman history was only sometimes the case. Rome was notable for many periods of coexisting dueling ideological groups with opposing political factions. And it had a few flareups like the catalinian conspiracy or triumvirate's proscriptions when the opposition was crushed but even then there was no national identity along a single ethos. Instead roman identity was more centered on the claim of shared civic privilege rather than shared civic virtues, identity or ideology.

Still the root has to be, fascism is about the strength of a united society that works towards a common good for the people, intolerant of dissent and opposition. That can exist in societies with or without class distinctions, autocratic or democratic, but it does require a coherent national identity like citizenship and it does require the exercise of power to be rooted exclusively in an ideologically homogenous body.
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Dec 14 2025 12:11am
Tribal society WAS bad. Tribal society has never flourished, not once in human history. Tribes were perpetually at war, fighting not in pitched battles but by trading night raids. This is what North American was before it was conquered. Sioux, Arikara, Pawnee, etc. etc. all killing each other. Tribal society evolved to city states which evolved to nation states with evolved to empire states.

King Agamemnon did a great thing by uniting the various Greek states. "I made a nation out of fire worshippers and snake eaters".


There is so many anti-intellectualism in being anti-national…but ofc there must be limits as to not become nazi
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